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Topic: Online Banking  (Read 5336 times)

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Online Banking
« on: March 17, 2009, 11:58:37 AM »
I really despise the level of online banking here in the UK (or at least with Lloyds).  Broadband access is so much more pervasive here than in the US, yet things like online banking here remind me of days long ago (late 1990s) when online banking was a new concept in the US.
At least with Lloyds, you get a silly string of random numbers as your user id.  No nice memorable username.  It's a useless string of 9 numbers (657832237...no, that isn't mine!).  Yeah, you do get the option of storing that number in the browser of choice, but it's limited to that computer and that browser.  If you happen to put in the wrong information, the number gets wiped, so then you'll have to dig through your paperwork to find the crappy letter the bank sent giving you your user id.  Once you get through the user id and password (which isn't too bad if you don't make typos and you use the same computer), you then have this second screen of annoyance where it asks for three random characters from your "memorable information."  So, if you have "extraneouscrap", the form may ask for characters 4, 8, and 12.  You don't get to type these in but rather select them from a drop-down list of the 26 letters and 10 numbers possible (btw, that would be r, o, r).  All of this to get to your online banking info, yet handing out the sort code and account number is perfectly normal!  In comparison, our US bank let us choose our own username and requires the whole "memorable info" thing only when money is moved around.
Oh, and since I'm still ticked with these extra hoops to see how much friggin' money I have, it looks like most UK banks don't have any kind of dynamic connection for money software (i.e. Quicken).  The best they have is the ability to download the last 30 days and hope that you don't end up with a charge twice on your side because of the overlap between this time and last time you downloaded your statement. Speaking of overlap, the banks (or at least Lloyds) doesn't show pending charges online.  Heelloooooo?!?  I'd like to know why my available balance is 100 quid short before a bogus charge goes through.
</rant>


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Re: Online Banking
« Reply #1 on: March 17, 2009, 12:07:47 PM »
I think your problem is more with the Lloyds website than anything else- Natwest does use a long string of numbers to identify you too, but at least the first half of the string is a meaningful set of numbers so it's fairly easy to remember.  They do the "enter the 1st, 3rd and 9th letter of your password" thing too, but you just type it in so it's not a big deal.  And I see pending charges on my online banking all the time.

WRT to connecting to your bank through an external program, I don't use Quicken, but I've used Yodlee Moneycentre to connect to my bank before, so at least some do have that facility.

Random anecdote: I once got locked out of my online banking because I typed in the wrong password too many times...I was under the impression that it was going to be an ordeal to get it back (the first letter they sent me about it never arrived) so I went without online banking for almost a year (unnecessarily as it turned out since it was a piece of cake to get it turned back on in the end!)
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Re: Online Banking
« Reply #2 on: March 17, 2009, 12:31:47 PM »
I think your problem is more with the Lloyds website than anything else- Natwest does use a long string of numbers to identify you too, but at least the first half of the string is a meaningful set of numbers so it's fairly easy to remember.  They do the "enter the 1st, 3rd and 9th letter of your password" thing too, but you just type it in so it's not a big deal.  And I see pending charges on my online banking all the time.

Same here - I've had my Natwest account for 7.5 years and online banking with them for around 5 years I think (I can't remember exactly when I signed up for the online banking). I know my user ID number and passwords off by heart anyway, so it's never taken me longer than about a minute to log into my account. I would say it is more to do with Lloyds not having a very user-friendly online system than it is to do with all UK online banking.

My account also shows pending charges - it will usually show that my pay cheque is going to be deposited the day before I get paid and when I use my debit card in a store, the transaction will usually show up on the online account by the end of the day, and if the individual transaction (say for £20) hasn't appeared on the statement yet, the balance at the top will say something like: balance = £100, available funds = £80.

I've actually found the US online banking process much more frustrating - so much so, that it's taken me 6 months since I moved back to the UK to set it up because it involved several calls to the US in order to get my password (and I was also told that I had to either come into the branch or write a letter to the US to change my address, instead of doing it over the phone :()... whereas the UK banks usually let you sign up online and then send you the password later.

Also, my friend in the US has been trying to transfer money into my US account for weeks, but unlike the UK banks which only require a sort code and account number, she needs my routing number, account number, name of branch, city the branch is in and my mailing address! But even with all of that information she hasn't been able to do it yet because apparently the system won't accept my UK address, even though that is the address on my bank account  >:(.


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Re: Online Banking
« Reply #3 on: March 17, 2009, 12:37:32 PM »
I agree that logging in to Lloyds online banking is waaaay more complex than it needs to be.  In their favor, they're really cool about stamping and signing statement printouts without a lot of hassle (at least they were in my local branch).


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Re: Online Banking
« Reply #4 on: March 17, 2009, 03:39:22 PM »
Ditto again - I use Natwest online banking practically daily so I know my codes & passwords off by heart.

What I find MOST annoying is those new card readers you need whenever making a new payment online...I get the added security and all, but that means whenever I need to something important like a new standing order, I have to wait until I get home from work (by which time I've usually forgotten).  Pain in the backside!
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Re: Online Banking
« Reply #5 on: March 17, 2009, 05:32:43 PM »
I use Natwest and it seems pretty OK to me. It's not really very hard and if they made it too easy then fraudsters would have an easier job, wouldn't they?


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Re: Online Banking
« Reply #6 on: March 17, 2009, 05:44:27 PM »
here's a tip that saves me a ton of time in terms of online logins etc:  i have a document in my gmail account where i store all of this info and save it as a draft.  whenever i forget something, i just open up the draft and copy and paste in the info i need. 


Re: Online Banking
« Reply #7 on: March 17, 2009, 05:50:41 PM »
i have a document in my gmail account where i store all of this info and save it as a draft.  whenever i forget something, i just open up the draft and copy and paste in the info i need. 

Hmmm.....

http://blog.cathyjonelson.com/?p=680


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Re: Online Banking
« Reply #8 on: March 17, 2009, 06:10:39 PM »
Funny, I found the US online banking system more of a pain in the backside.

IIRC, Barclays online banking is just the same as Lloyds and I've had no problems with either.

Of course you want more security with your online banking details as that's where you're able to move money around - you wouldn't want any old Tom, Dick or Harry having that ability.


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Re: Online Banking
« Reply #9 on: March 18, 2009, 09:50:59 AM »
I don't mind the security, but there is a point where it becomes useless excess.  I like having to put in my password to confirm a moving of funds, but then to have to enter in random characters of "memorable information" and have a random string of numbers for a user id is too much.  Sure, it'd be a trade off of some security if my user id was something I chose ("impleri") or an email address of mine, but it'd also make the system slightly easier to use.  I wouldn't mind if there were a few (e.g. three) random numbers after my chosen login. I'm not sure about other banks, but Lloyds sends a little business card to write down your user id so that you don't forget...I'm sorry, but writing something down that should be treated as sensitive is the wrong way to go.  The idea behind a secure login/password is that one does not need to write it down while still remaining difficult enough for others to figure out.  If all of my logins (or, heaven forbid!, passwords) were written down on a sheet near my computer, then it's not a very secure system as anyone who has access to my computer can have access to that (and under the keyboard is the first place to look for a password).
Also, if one forgets his user id he has two options: find the paper the bank sent with the id on it (which, again, is not a very secure option), or request the bank to send a copy of that paper (which means waiting 2-3 working days)!
Regarding Gmail, I have 2-3 problems with that.  First, the problem with having written passwords from above.  Second, anything on a networked location is susceptible to some kind of epic fail ("we're sorry but private, identifying data regarding your account may have been lost.").  Third, I don't like the Great Eye of Sauron Google looking at my information.  I have a handful of computers accessible from the internet which I consider more secure than Gmail (SSH, for instance), but I still refuse to put any of my personal data on those for similar reasons (anyone geeky enough to remember the recent problem Debian had with its OpenSSL?).  So, I think it all comes down to: something that is written down can become publicly accessible (by accident, even), which is not the ideal security.


Re: Online Banking
« Reply #10 on: March 18, 2009, 10:56:23 AM »
writing something down that should be treated as sensitive is the wrong way to go.

Right!

Quote
Second, anything on a networked location is susceptible to some kind of epic fail

Right!!

Quote
I don't like the Great Eye of Sauron Google looking at my information.

Right!!!



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Re: Online Banking
« Reply #11 on: March 18, 2009, 11:01:58 AM »
I'm with Halifax - you just have a user name which can be meaningful to you, password again mine is meaningful and then it has a number of questions to which you've previously keyed in the answer and asks one of these (e.g. town of birth, mothers first name etc)
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Re: Online Banking
« Reply #12 on: March 18, 2009, 03:23:02 PM »
those are good points, but i don't write down passwords in the documents i keep in email...i suppose there are still ways to request a password to be sent to you if you know the username, but i don't use my gmail account to receive passwords, so i feel it's pretty secure to store the usernames there...


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Re: Online Banking
« Reply #13 on: March 18, 2009, 10:28:38 PM »
you then have this second screen of annoyance where it asks for three random characters from your "memorable information."  So, if you have "extraneouscrap", the form may ask for characters 4, 8, and 12.  You don't get to type these in but rather select them from a drop-down list of the 26 letters and 10 numbers possible (btw, that would be r, o, r). 

I'm with Lloyds-TSB and find that ridiculously laborious too.  In fact I get annoyed with a lot of online forms which insist on you using drop down selection boxes to enter information which could simply be typed into a field and then verified when sent, such as entering a date.  Click on a drop-down box for the month and then select "March."  Click on another drop-down box for the day, scroll down until you find "18" and select it.  Do the same for the year.   It all takes at least three to four times as long as just going to one entry field and just typing "3/18/09."   :-\\\\


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Re: Online Banking
« Reply #14 on: March 19, 2009, 07:16:00 AM »
I'm with Lloyds-TSB and find that ridiculously laborious too.  In fact I get annoyed with a lot of online forms which insist on you using drop down selection boxes to enter information which could simply be typed into a field and then verified when sent, such as entering a date.  Click on a drop-down box for the month and then select "March."  Click on another drop-down box for the day, scroll down until you find "18" and select it.  Do the same for the year.   It all takes at least three to four times as long as just going to one entry field and just typing "3/18/09."   :-\\\\




With some of those drop-down boxes you can, once the box is tabbed to or clicked on, type in some or all of the required information.  Not all will allow this but I have found that a lot do.  Also, two things I have found helpful are Firefox and the Sxipper add-on.  Sxipper remembers or can be trained to remember all your log on information for any sites you belong to.


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