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Topic: electricity: day and night  (Read 2613 times)

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electricity: day and night
« on: April 14, 2009, 02:45:47 PM »
I have heard rumors that there are day and night rates for elecricity. I got my first bill. Apparently I am using EON. My bill lists primary units (20.02 p/kWh) and secondary units (10.05p/kWh). From the EON website it seems like these are not day and night rates. It seems like you need to buy a fixed amount of expensive units (primary) and then you get the cheap units (secondary). Does this mean I do not have different day and night rates?

If the rates are the same, is their a reason to care when I use electricty?

I am pretty happy with my usage numbers. I looked on the consumption thread and I seem to be no more wasteful then anyone else. My wife and I used 800 kWh in a month for our 2 bedroom all electric (heat, hob, and oven) flat. We did a lot of extra laundry and drying and extra dishes from unpacking and buying new stuff.


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Re: electricity: day and night
« Reply #1 on: April 14, 2009, 03:08:54 PM »
You can usually different types of accounts from your provider based on your usage. Go to their website and see what they have to offer.
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Re: electricity: day and night
« Reply #2 on: April 14, 2009, 03:50:44 PM »
All's I know is, our main house transformer gives a loud clunk when the rates go down. Sadly, it clunks at 12:07, 12:22 and 12:27, and we're not sure which one is right. Being desperately mean, we do no laundry until after the third clunk. And, in the Summer time, that's all shifted forward an hour. So we start the laundry at 1:27.

We do a lot of drunkwashing.


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Re: electricity: day and night
« Reply #3 on: April 14, 2009, 06:17:41 PM »
Does this mean I do not have different day and night rates?

If your bill shows only two sets of entries - primary & secondary units - then no, you are not on a scheme which gives different day and night rates.   That's consistent with the tariffs you quote too.  There are variations in prices from one supplier to another, but at the moment cheap night-rate power is generally about half your secondary units cost (e.g. my e-on plan currently charges 27.8p primary day, 11.9p secondary day, and 5.4p night per unit, exc. VAT).

The primary/secondary units scheme has been adopted by many suppliers in recent years in lieu of the older scheme which charged only a single, basic rate per unit but added a standing service charge of a few pounds per quarter.

The original intent of cheap night-rate electricity was mostly for electric storage heating, where the thermal bricks in the heater are warmed up using cheap power overnight, then release their heat gradually during the day.   Some of the older plans had cheap-rate power only for the heating, and everything else in the house was charged at the same rates day and night.   These were commonly referred to as "White Meter" plans, since there was a completely separate meter used to record the energy used for the heating and this meter was white to distinguish it from the black meters used for everything else at the time.

These days, the entire house is switched to the cheap rate power overnight.  There can still be a switching arrangement to turn on power for storage heating; the "clunk" you hear when the cheap rate starts is the contactor which applies power to the heaters operating.

Economy 7 is the most common plan, so named because it provides cheap rate power for 7 hours each night, typically midnight to 7 a.m. in winter, 1 a.m. to 8 a.m. in summer.   In some areas the times can be a half-hour or so different though, and sometimes even along the same street you will find staggered times, since the timings are set up to avoid everybody's heating all coming all simultaneously and suddenly throwing a heavy load on the grid.   Economy 7 gives you the cheap rate at night, but often with the penalty of having to pay slightly more per unit during the day (or a higher quarterly standing charge under the older schemes). 

There are some other plans as well which can provide cheaper rates at certain times, for example Economy 10 which is basically Economy 7 plus some mid-rate power for 3 hours during the afternoon.


we're not sure which one is right.

The meter usually indicates which rate is in operation at any given time.  On a newer meter with LCD readout, it will have something showing "Rate 1" or "Rate 2" on the display which will change at the appropriate time (there are many different types of meter in use, so it's impossible to be precise without knowing which sort you have).  On the older type of meter with a mechanical readout, there will be a little mechanical flag of some sort, typically an arrow which rotates to indicate "Normal" and "Low" (or "Day" and "Night").
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Re: electricity: day and night
« Reply #4 on: April 14, 2009, 07:53:55 PM »
Thank you, Paul. Simultaneously geeky and helpful, as always.


Re: electricity: day and night
« Reply #5 on: April 14, 2009, 08:03:03 PM »
Summary: You only get cheaper electricity at night, if you are on a plan that specifically includes this.



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Re: electricity: day and night
« Reply #6 on: April 14, 2009, 08:07:15 PM »
Thank you paul. Not only do you know your stuff, but you are also able to express it well to people who have no idea what is what.

I am glad to hear my tariffs are not crazy high. It sounds like I could save some money if I think about my usage patterns and then shop around for prices. I live in a large building and my meter is not accessible to me, so I will have to estimate/guess on my usage.



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Re: electricity: day and night
« Reply #7 on: April 15, 2009, 06:11:58 PM »
I live in a large building and my meter is not accessible to me, so I will have to estimate/guess on my usage.

Is your meter in a communal utility area to which only the building supervisor or maintenance man has access?   
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Re: electricity: day and night
« Reply #8 on: April 15, 2009, 07:18:34 PM »
Summary: You only get cheaper electricity at night, if you are on a plan that specifically includes this.



I was going to mention that - you have to be on the Economy 7 tariff (or whatever it's called these days) in order to get the cheaper rate over night
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Re: electricity: day and night
« Reply #9 on: April 16, 2009, 02:48:39 PM »
If you can't access them, how can the meter reader?


Vicky


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Re: electricity: day and night
« Reply #10 on: April 16, 2009, 05:03:27 PM »
You should be able to access your meter...just like you should read your meter on a semi-regular basis.  I've caught Scottish Power "estimating" 700 kWh (600 on the Econ7, 100 on the regular) more than my usage, which can turn into a lot of money (that one happened to be £35).


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Re: electricity: day and night
« Reply #11 on: April 16, 2009, 06:24:06 PM »
Is your meter in a communal utility area to which only the building supervisor or maintenance man has access?  


Yes exactly. My wife got a meter reading when we moved in. I am not sure if the building supervisor let her see the meter, or just read it for her. I am sure I could get a reading at some point if I wanted.


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Re: electricity: day and night
« Reply #12 on: April 16, 2009, 06:25:20 PM »
If you don't get one you may find that your bills are based on estimates, and you will therefore almost certainly pay more.

Vicky


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Re: electricity: day and night
« Reply #13 on: April 16, 2009, 06:56:22 PM »
If you can't access them, how can the meter reader?

Some meters can now be read by telemetry, i.e. the meter reader doesn't have to physically look at the meter or even be in the same room with it, just be close enough to activate it and receive the signal back which gives the readings.  It can be done from outside the building. 

If that isn't the case though, I agree that you need to be careful if you start receiving estimated readings on a regular basis.   Over a period of a year or more they can end up being wildly inaccurate, either up or down.   

Bills normally show if estimates have been used, typically with an "e" against the readings, although there are other methods.  Some utilities now automatically use estimates every other quarter so that they only have to send meter readers out at 6-monthly intervals.   

If the reader can't access your meter to take the readings, he will normally leave a card telling you that he called.  You can either wait until he returns, or read the meter yourself and either leave the card to be collected or phone the readings in yourself.  You can often use the latter option too after receiving an estimated bill, in which case the power company will then issue a revised bill based upon your readings (again, the bill usually tags customer-provided readings with a "c" next to the amount or by some similar method).
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Re: electricity: day and night
« Reply #14 on: April 16, 2009, 07:05:57 PM »
Some meters can now be read by telemetry, i.e. the meter reader doesn't have to physically look at the meter or even be in the same room with it, just be close enough to activate it and receive the signal back which gives the readings.  It can be done from outside the building. 



Wow, I'd never trust that!


Vicky


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