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Topic: US: Bigger is better???  (Read 2718 times)

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US: Bigger is better???
« on: October 25, 2009, 11:57:27 PM »
US. I read a front page article (small city) about a grocery shop that was closing down after 80? years. They were able to survive when a shop from Salt Lake City (big  City) branched out here then came Albertsons, Costco and finally Wal-mart. They couldn't  survive any more so they are closing down.

The newspaper showed a photo of a 100 year old woman pushing a grocery cart and she said didn't know how she would handle shopping now that the neighborhood grocery shop was closing. Sad really. This lady seems to be in very good shape from the picture from what I could see.

The problem I see is that the lady is going to loose her independence by having to get a ride or have to order her food from one of the two services that exist were you can order by phone. She also loses out on some exercise and some socializing when she goes to the local store.

OK. I read on here frequently about how we all love to go Morrison's, Tesco or what ever for their low prices but we may forget the true cost to others.

Correct me but aren't there still a fair amount of independent grocery shops still in the UK?

So when I see UK headlines announcing that a new supermarket wants to come into town and demolish an old castle ;) or a farmers cattle market to make room for it or the more common announcement when I read it will create 3000 ;) more jobs I have to think of the other cost to the community.

Is big better?

I have read that a lot of UK dairy farmers are having to sell up because the amount they get for their milk doesn't cover their expenses. Undoubtedly this is because the Cooperatives or ? have their price dictated by the large supermarkets.

Incidentally we had a large discount supermarket open up this week in SLC and there were crowds around the block and they are giving Wal-mart a run for their money in the areas they have opened already. Yea!

My point. Is big better? What is the cost to the people who loose their jobs and local shops?

I have flipped in using the UK and US but the issue is in both countries.
« Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 12:06:39 AM by Master Jay »


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Re: US: Bigger is better???
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2009, 12:31:52 PM »
It all depends on the local situation as to whether big is better.
My friend lives in a small town in Scotland and the local shop sells gross fruit and veg and expired can goods.  They would love a Tesco as it is an hour to the closest one.

But no, there are hardly any independent grocery stores here. 

There a few butchers or bakers or whatever where I live, but not more independent shops than when I lived in towns of comparable size in the US.  In the US it was not so much butchers, but small ethnic stores and bakeries. 


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Re: US: Bigger is better???
« Reply #2 on: October 26, 2009, 12:42:08 PM »
Bigger is not better.
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Re: US: Bigger is better???
« Reply #3 on: October 26, 2009, 12:59:25 PM »
That all depends...

Don't think there any independants now. Even most of the convenient stores are now run by a large company (Coop, KeyStores, etc).

We have a few bakeries, fish mongers and butchers that are local run and they are thriving (judging by the queues) considering we have two major supermarkets in town and a Lidl to boot.
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Re: US: Bigger is better???
« Reply #4 on: October 26, 2009, 01:04:23 PM »
I don't know. I'm pretty torn about this one. There is a local fruit and veg shop, a butcher, a frozen foods shop (Heron) and a bakery on our high street. There is also a small Tesco Express store and two small Co-Op stores. The problem I have is mainly the convenience factor. I don't get off work until 4:30, so all of the independent high street shops are closed by then, but the Tesco Express and two Co-Op stores are open late. If I run out of something, I can walk a block to the smaller of the two Co-Ops and get most basic necessities, up until 10pm, so that is normally what I have to do. Before I started work, I would walk up and down the high street in the morning or afternoon and get a little shopping done at several places. But since DH and I both work the same hours, which is also the only time the independent shops are open, then we are pretty much forced to drive the 10 miles to Sainsburys and get all of our shopping done in one go. The shops are open on Saturday, but we would have to have to walk a mile to the high street because there is no parking, then walk back with loads of bags because we can only get one big shop in each week, rather than walking to the smaller shops each day and picking up a few items (which is what my MIL does and what I used to do when I didn't work these hours.) Also, in order to do this method, it would take quite a bit longer than driving to Sainsburys and picking up our things. So, although I would like to support the independent high street shops, unfortunately it is so inconvenient to do so most of the time.


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Re: US: Bigger is better???
« Reply #5 on: October 26, 2009, 01:05:51 PM »
Don't think there any independants now. Even most of the convenient stores are now run by a large company (Coop, KeyStores, etc).

Of course there are! And thank goodness for that!
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Re: US: Bigger is better???
« Reply #6 on: October 26, 2009, 01:21:31 PM »
I have the same problem as Jewlz- we have a pretty large grocery store (actually 2) near us where we do most of our grocery shopping, and there is also a butcher and a couple of independent fruit & veg shops we can go to as well.  I'd love to go to the butcher, but since they're only open when I'm at work, that's pretty much a non-starter.  Whereas the big grocery store is open until 10pm. No brainer, really.

The local fruit and veg shop is open at the weekend, but we get a veg box delivered from River Swale (love!)
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Re: US: Bigger is better???
« Reply #7 on: October 26, 2009, 01:25:13 PM »
I agree with Jewlz completely.

The butcher on my way to work is only open in the am not on my way home as is the bakers, so I would have no where to put all my shopping.  Plus, I take the bus and it takes an hour, not exactly great with meat. 


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Re: US: Bigger is better???
« Reply #8 on: October 26, 2009, 04:55:08 PM »
I'm sorry some of you can't shop when you are working but I look at things a little differently and think of the staff who work at these places and realize they can have normal hours and therefore engage in normal social activities like everyone else.
I have seen how having these irregular working hours plays havoc with families and not being able to do things together because of their irregular working hours.
I remember with one union in the UK they wanted premium pay for working unsocial hours. I like that. It reminds me when I had to work on Thanksgiving here in the states and I found I was not needed but was told that they had to work so I had to work. I was the only one not at the family Thanksgiving table that year.
A lot of people here in the states hate working irregular hours but if they want a job that's what they have to do. I say double or triple their pay if they have to work irregular hours.

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Re: US: Bigger is better???
« Reply #9 on: October 26, 2009, 05:10:23 PM »
Well, I agree and that is all fine; they don't have to be open when people can actually shop there.

But then they can't complain when they close down due to lack of business.   I am not saying they need to be open until 10 pm, but they close at 4:30.  So anyone who works 9-5 can't shop at most of the local businesses near me.  Most are barely hanging on, but that is there own issue.





Re: US: Bigger is better???
« Reply #10 on: October 26, 2009, 05:12:29 PM »
Lots of people have to work "unsociable" hours, and working until 7pm or on weekends probably wouldn't count as unsociable in their eyes.

But when a company makes working hours a priority, then they can't expect their customers to knot up their lives to try to support them.  That's their priority, and while it might work out for them, it might cost them business.  That's how the world works.

Personally, I will shop at both chains and independent shops provided they are opened when I need to shop and offer card payments.  I will also pay higher prices if the quality is there.  I won't pay higher prices for poor product like I would at our local green grocers.  I also don't see corner supermarkets as adequate replacements for a proper grocery shop.  We'd go broke trying to feed ourselves there (not to mention probably malnourished). That's not how they make their money anyway.  They're the place you go to pick up the milk or desert when you don't want to run down to the shops.

But this isn't new news.  People have had their choices in grocery shopping limited more and more in both countries for years.  Try shopping in a disadvantaged neighbourhood in a Rustbelt city like Detroit or Buffalo.  I bet you will see how bad it can be.  This is what inner city and very rural people have been dealing with for decades.  Things like the gigantic growth of Walmart have just made things worse.

« Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 05:19:35 PM by Legs Akimbo »


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Re: US: Bigger is better???
« Reply #11 on: October 26, 2009, 05:28:53 PM »
 I am not saying they need to be open until 10 pm, but they close at 4:30. 


Isn't that half day closing? ;D

I think we could both compromise and ask them to be open until 6 pm.


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Re: US: Bigger is better???
« Reply #12 on: October 26, 2009, 09:00:12 PM »
6 would be ok with me! 


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Re: US: Bigger is better???
« Reply #13 on: October 27, 2009, 08:32:12 AM »
We only have a butcher in Epsom, now. The greengrocer and bakery closed when Sainsbury's opened. Don't know if we ever had a fishmonger.

We still buy our meat from the butcher, at least, as he can tell me exactly where the meat came from. I can go in and order something special (like a turkey for Thanksgiving :roll: Try finding a fresh turkey in November in this country! He even knows when Thanksgiving is. The 12 year old that works in the meat aisle in Sainsbury's doesn't).

Problem is, they want to build a big Tesco in the upper high street, across the street from the butcher.

This will surely sound the death knell for him. People go on and on about saving the high street, as they're walking from the free Tesco car park into Tesco to buy their cheap meat.

We already have a Waitrose, M&S, co-op and a sainsbury's. Do we really need Tesco as well?




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Re: US: Bigger is better???
« Reply #14 on: October 27, 2009, 08:47:29 AM »
We have a Tesco, Coop, Morrisons and Lidl ... but fortunately all the little towns around here also have at least one butcher, fishmonger, greengrocer and baker. Penzance has several of each, as well as a fab farmers' market on Fridays.
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