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Topic: Tier 2 (?) questions  (Read 1123 times)

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Tier 2 (?) questions
« on: August 02, 2014, 01:15:14 AM »
Ok, these questions may have already been asked but seeing as there are 857 pages of questions here, I thought I'd just start a new topic.
My husband & I are trying to find a way to relocate to Scotland.  His company has job openings in Edinburgh and may sponsor his visa.  Will we still have to meet the savings requirement?  Or will his projected income be enough?
Also, I'm sure I'd like to be working once we get there.  I'm a nurse in the US but the requirements are different in Scotland and I won't be "qualified".  So what kind of visa would I need if I'd like to look for work once we got there (assuming we get to go)?  And would I then have to meet the savings requirement?
Any advice would be great!!


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Re: Tier 2 (?) questions
« Reply #1 on: August 02, 2014, 03:32:23 AM »
What do you mean by 'the savings requirement'? A Tier 2 visa requires that you score points based on his job/salary, his English language skills and the maintenance (savings) requirement specified in the Tier 2 guidance. You must meet all the requirements and score all the points needed to get the visa. The only reason you would not need to meet the savings requirement is if the Certificate of Sponsorship has certain information on it.

If he gets a sponsored Tier 2 visa then you should be able to qualify for a Tier 2 Dependent visa which will allow you to work in any job you like without needing a separate work visa.

See here for what requirements he will need to meet for the Tier 2 visa: https://www.gov.uk/tier-2-general/eligibility


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Re: Tier 2 (?) questions
« Reply #2 on: August 02, 2014, 09:19:21 AM »
Ok, these questions may have already been asked but seeing as there are 857 pages of questions here, I thought I'd just start a new topic.
My husband & I are trying to find a way to relocate to Scotland.  His company has job openings in Edinburgh and may sponsor his visa.  Will we still have to meet the savings requirement?  Or will his projected income be enough?
Also, I'm sure I'd like to be working once we get there.  I'm a nurse in the US but the requirements are different in Scotland and I won't be "qualified".  So what kind of visa would I need if I'd like to look for work once we got there (assuming we get to go)?  And would I then have to meet the savings requirement?
Any advice would be great!!

Bear in mind that this would be an intra company transfer (ICT) Tier 2 visa. This has been decoupled with permanent settlement in recent years. So you would probably get a max of 5-6 years before you would have to return (presumably to the US). Obviously, rules might change in the coming years, but it is becoming much much harder to settle long term in the UK.
2004-2008: Student Visa
2008-2010: Tier 1 PSW
2010-2011: Tier 4
2011-2014: Tier 2
2013-2016: New Tier 2 (changed jobs)
16/12/15: SET (LR) successful! - It's been a long road...
12/05/16: Citizenship ceremony!


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Re: Tier 2 (?) questions
« Reply #3 on: August 02, 2014, 01:08:08 PM »
Ok this helps a bit.  We're sure we can get a sponsored visa from his company, but we don't have the 945 in savings (continuously) for the last 3 months, so we're trying to figure another way around that.  I think I read somewhere that if the sponsor says we won't claim benefits, then we don't have to meet the savings requirement.  Am i reading correctly? 
I'm also thinking if we're there for 5 years, we can apply for ILR, then later apply for citizenship after 10 years.  Am I following the timeline right?


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Re: Tier 2 (?) questions
« Reply #4 on: August 02, 2014, 01:21:43 PM »
Ok this helps a bit.  We're sure we can get a sponsored visa from his company, but we don't have the 945 in savings (continuously) for the last 3 months, so we're trying to figure another way around that.  I think I read somewhere that if the sponsor says we won't claim benefits, then we don't have to meet the savings requirement.  Am i reading correctly?  

That's what it says in the link for the Tier 2 General visa, but you won't be applying for that visa, you will be applying for a Tier 2 ICT visa (sorry, I posted the wrong link for you - I was at work and posting from my phone, so I didn't have time to check all the details).

For a Tier 2 ICT visa, in order to get around the savings part, the employer needs to certify that they will support and accommodate you for the first month of UK employment. If there are dependants too (you and any children), the company must also certify that they will provide at least another £630 for each of you for that first month:
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You don’t need to have £945 in savings if your sponsor is fully approved (‘A-rated) and they can certify that they’ll support and accommodate you for the first month you’re employed - check your sponsor’s rating.
(https://www.gov.uk/tier-2-intracompany-transfer-worker-visa/eligibility)

and
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You won’t need evidence of your savings if you have a letter from your fully approved (‘A-rated’) sponsor saying they’ll provide 1 month’s funding of at least £630 for each of your dependants.
(https://www.gov.uk/tier-2-intracompany-transfer-worker-visa/family-members)

Basically, if the company is not able to do this, you're going to have to wait until you have had the full amount savings in your account for at least 90 days.

Also, bear in mind that if you are applying for Tier 2 ICT Dependant visas for yourself and any children, the savings requirement is higher... you will also need an extra £630 per person applying for a dependant visa on top of the £945, and it must all have been in the account for 90 days.

So, if there are 3 of you (you, your husband and 1 child), you will need savings of £2,205 in your account for 90 days before applying.

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I'm also thinking if we're there for 5 years, we can apply for ILR, then later apply for citizenship after 10 years.  Am I following the timeline right?

No, not if you're on a Tier 2 ICT visa (or are dependants of that visa).

No one on a Tier 2 visa can qualify for ILR or citizenship. You can only qualify for ILR/citizenship on a Tier 2 ICT visa if that visa was issued before April 2010 (in that case, it would be ILR after 5 years, then citizenship after holding ILR for 12 months).

As your visas will be issued in 2014/2015, you will only be allowed to stay in the UK for a maximum of 5 years and then you will have to return to live in the US without being able to apply for ILR or citizenship.
« Last Edit: August 02, 2014, 01:30:28 PM by ksand24 »


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Re: Tier 2 (?) questions
« Reply #5 on: August 02, 2014, 04:32:34 PM »

No one on a Tier 2 visa can qualify for ILR or citizenship. You can only qualify for ILR/citizenship on a Tier 2 ICT visa if that visa was issued before April 2010 (in that case, it would be ILR after 5 years, then citizenship after holding ILR for 12 months).

As your visas will be issued in 2014/2015, you will only be allowed to stay in the UK for a maximum of 5 years and then you will have to return to live in the US without being able to apply for ILR or citizenship.

No one on a Tier 2 ICT can qualify...

People on a Tier 2 GENERAL visa can still qualify for ILR after 5 years. After 2016, they have to meet the earnings requirement of £35,000 per annum, or they have to be a shortage occupation worker.

Working visas have (more recently) been decoupled from long term settlement.
2004-2008: Student Visa
2008-2010: Tier 1 PSW
2010-2011: Tier 4
2011-2014: Tier 2
2013-2016: New Tier 2 (changed jobs)
16/12/15: SET (LR) successful! - It's been a long road...
12/05/16: Citizenship ceremony!


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Re: Tier 2 (?) questions
« Reply #6 on: August 02, 2014, 04:40:22 PM »
No one on a Tier 2 ICT can qualify...

I checked the UKVI website before I posted. Some people can still qualify, but only if their original ICT visas were issued a number of years ago.

It says you can qualify for ILR with a Tier 2 ICT visa if you have held at least ONE of these visas in the last 5 years:

- Tier 2 (Intra-Company Transfer) issued under the Immigration Rules in place before 6 April 2010

- Work Permit for an intra-company transfer

(https://www.gov.uk/settle-in-the-uk/y/you-have-a-work-visa/tier-2-intra-company-transfer)


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Re: Tier 2 (?) questions
« Reply #7 on: August 02, 2014, 05:21:18 PM »
Wow.  So basically if they give him a Tier 2 ICT visa, we won't be able to settle in Scotland?  We only have 5 years?
If they give him a Tier 2 general visa we should be able to apply for ILR? 

I guess I don't understand why they wouldn't let you stay if your company is transferring you.  Seems like if the company needs you, the country would let you stay.


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Re: Tier 2 (?) questions
« Reply #8 on: August 02, 2014, 06:00:06 PM »
Wow.  So basically if they give him a Tier 2 ICT visa, we won't be able to settle in Scotland?  We only have 5 years?

Yes, that's correct. The UK government has tightened the visa regulations in order to prevent as many people as possible from being able to settle/stay in the UK.

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If they give him a Tier 2 general visa we should be able to apply for ILR? 

Yes, but only if he can meet all the salary and residency requirements for ILR when the time comes.

However, it can be much more difficult to qualify for a Tier 2 General visa than a Tier 2 ICT visa, and you may find that the company can only sponsor the ICT visa and not a General one (I'm not sure what happens if he tries to get a General visa for a company he already works for or if he will have no choice but to go the ICT route).

In order for him to qualify for a Tier 2 General visa, the job position either has to be listed on the Skills Shortage List, or the company has to show that they have advertised the position across the UK and all 26 other EU countries and could not find a single suitable candidate before they are allowed to hire him.

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I guess I don't understand why they wouldn't let you stay if your company is transferring you.  Seems like if the company needs you, the country would let you stay.

But as it's a company in the UK, the priority for jobs is given to UK/EU citizens - then the Tier 2 visas should only generally be issued if there is no one else in the UK who can do the job.

It may not be a good idea to go into the move with the intention of settling permanently, because 5 years is a long time and who knows what will happen between now and then, both with visas/immigration and with your personal situation. It might be better to view it as something that you would like to be long-term, but accept that it may only be temporary.

You're lucky to be in a position where he has the opportunity to apply for a Tier 2 ICT visa... I know of people who have been trying for years to qualify for a Tier 2 General with no luck, and they find themselves wishing they worked for a company with branches in the UK so they could just transfer on an ICT visa instead.


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Re: Tier 2 (?) questions
« Reply #9 on: August 02, 2014, 08:03:33 PM »
I checked the UKVI website before I posted. Some people can still qualify, but only if their original ICT visas were issued a number of years ago.

It says you can qualify for ILR with a Tier 2 ICT visa if you have held at least ONE of these visas in the last 5 years:

- Tier 2 (Intra-Company Transfer) issued under the Immigration Rules in place before 6 April 2010

- Work Permit for an intra-company transfer

(https://www.gov.uk/settle-in-the-uk/y/you-have-a-work-visa/tier-2-intra-company-transfer)

Ok ok, responding to the OP, no one issued a Tier 2 ICT now (or at any point in the future as the rules stand) will qualify for ILR based on the provisions of being a Tier 2 ICT worker. If they can manage to stay in the UK for 10 years, they will be eligible for 10 years long residence...
2004-2008: Student Visa
2008-2010: Tier 1 PSW
2010-2011: Tier 4
2011-2014: Tier 2
2013-2016: New Tier 2 (changed jobs)
16/12/15: SET (LR) successful! - It's been a long road...
12/05/16: Citizenship ceremony!


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Re: Tier 2 (?) questions
« Reply #10 on: August 02, 2014, 08:06:17 PM »
Wow.  So basically if they give him a Tier 2 ICT visa, we won't be able to settle in Scotland?  We only have 5 years?
If they give him a Tier 2 general visa we should be able to apply for ILR?  


I seem to recall that you cannot have worked for the company before? Hmm... I will do some digging!!!

It is less expensive and burdensome on the company to transfer him as an ICT.

Edit:
Ok, after a bit of digging, it seems that the main difference is the Resident Labour market test. In order to sponsor a Tier 2 general worker:
Sponsors must "c) Not assign a CoS where there is no genuine vacancy or role, for example:
▪ for a job or role that does not exist in order to enable a migrant to come to, or stay in the UK. "

So there must be a genuine vacancy that 'cannot' be filled by a settled worker in order to qualify for a T2G.

If you try to get the company to go for T2G, they run the genuine risk of a settled worker having the same qualifications. Even if the settled worker has LESS experience or knowledge, they would have to be offered the role if they met the job description...
« Last Edit: August 02, 2014, 08:34:28 PM by physicskate »
2004-2008: Student Visa
2008-2010: Tier 1 PSW
2010-2011: Tier 4
2011-2014: Tier 2
2013-2016: New Tier 2 (changed jobs)
16/12/15: SET (LR) successful! - It's been a long road...
12/05/16: Citizenship ceremony!


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Re: Tier 2 (?) questions
« Reply #11 on: August 02, 2014, 09:35:50 PM »

But as it's a company in the UK, the priority for jobs is given to UK/EU citizens - then the Tier 2 visas should only generally be issued if there is no one else in the UK who can do the job.

It may not be a good idea to go into the move with the intention of settling permanently, because 5 years is a long time and who knows what will happen between now and then, both with visas/immigration and with your personal situation. It might be better to view it as something that you would like to be long-term, but accept that it may only be temporary.

You're lucky to be in a position where he has the opportunity to apply for a Tier 2 ICT visa... I know of people who have been trying for years to qualify for a Tier 2 General with no luck, and they find themselves wishing they worked for a company with branches in the UK so they could just transfer on an ICT visa instead.

I understand that they're trying to keep down unemployment of their own citizens.  I totally respect that.
And I guess we could try to get there on the ICT visa and hope that we will have an opportunity to stay longer.  It seems like the rules change all the time!!!
I wonder if I got a job while we were there, if we would be able to apply for ILR after a while?  At least long enough to get us to the 10 year residency requirement?  I'm a nurse but not an RN, so I can't register on their council.  I have over 10 years experience though.  Any thoughts on if that would work?


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Re: Tier 2 (?) questions
« Reply #12 on: August 02, 2014, 09:41:44 PM »
Be sure to research a Tier 2 thoroughly...

If you want to switch sponsors (to switch to a Tier 2 General), you will have to leave and have a 12 month cooling off period outside of the UK, before you can apply for the new visa...

I would honestly look at this as an opportunity for 5 years and then set a new goal.  My goal was to live here for 2 years and then get a job in Shanghai.


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Re: Tier 2 (?) questions
« Reply #13 on: August 03, 2014, 12:01:19 AM »
Be sure to research a Tier 2 thoroughly...

If you want to switch sponsors (to switch to a Tier 2 General), you will have to leave and have a 12 month cooling off period outside of the UK, before you can apply for the new visa...

I would honestly look at this as an opportunity for 5 years and then set a new goal.  My goal was to live here for 2 years and then get a job in Shanghai.

A Tier 2 ICT dependent (which is what a spouse would be) is not subject to the 12 month cooling off...

So in theory, if YOU could find sponsorship (if you cannot register with the Nursing and Midwifery council that would be super unlikely), you would be able to switch to Tier 2 general (if you could reach the requirements) and your spouse could become your dependent... in theory.
2004-2008: Student Visa
2008-2010: Tier 1 PSW
2010-2011: Tier 4
2011-2014: Tier 2
2013-2016: New Tier 2 (changed jobs)
16/12/15: SET (LR) successful! - It's been a long road...
12/05/16: Citizenship ceremony!


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Re: Tier 2 (?) questions
« Reply #14 on: August 03, 2014, 07:49:50 AM »
I wonder if I got a job while we were there, if we would be able to apply for ILR after a while?  At least long enough to get us to the 10 year residency requirement?  I'm a nurse but not an RN, so I can't register on their council.  I have over 10 years experience though.  Any thoughts on if that would work?

Once you arrive, if you could get sponsorship for a Tier 2 General visa, you could change to a Tier 2 General visa and then you could apply for ILR after 5 years on the Tier 2 General.

However, as you will already be in the UK with permission to work in any job you like (as a Tier 2 ICT Dependant), I can't see any company being willing to sponsor you for a Tier 2 General, when they can just hire you without sponsorship and save themselves a load of time, money and hassle.

Plus, to sponsor you for a Tier 2 General, they would need to prove that there was no one else in the UK/EU who already has permission to work who could do the job... but as you would have permission to work and could do the job, they would then have to discount you from being able to do the job in order to issue a Tier 2 General to someone else - so it would be a vicious circle.

The only way it would work would be if you waited until your Tier 2 ICT visa was about to expire and then you got sponsorship for a Tier 2 General in order to stay, and your husband and child switched to Tier 2 General dependants.

A Tier 2 ICT dependent (which is what a spouse would be) is not subject to the 12 month cooling off...

So in theory, if YOU could find sponsorship (if you cannot register with the Nursing and Midwifery council that would be super unlikely), you would be able to switch to Tier 2 general (if you could reach the requirements) and your spouse could become your dependent... in theory.

Looking at the requirements for switching to Tier 2 General, it appears that they would still would have to return to the US to apply, even if there is no cooling-off period, as it says only dependants of Tier 4 Student visa holders (not Tier 2 dependants) can apply from inside the UK:

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Eligibility

You must already be in the UK under any of the following visas or schemes:

 -   Tier 1 visa
 -   Tier 2 (Sportsperson) visa
 -   Tier 2 (Minister of religion) visa
-    Tier 2 (Intra company Transfer: established staff) visa and you’re applying to change sponsor
-    Tier 2 (Intra company Transfer) visa under the Immigration Rules in place before 6 April 2010 and you’re applying to change sponsor
-    Tier 4 visa, or you’re on another kind of student visa - read ‘Switching from a Tier 4 visa’ below
-    Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Creative and sporting) for a job as a professional footballer and you meet the Tier 2 (Sportsperson) requirements
-    Highly Skilled Migrant Programme
-    Innovator Scheme
-    Fresh Talent: Working in Scotland Scheme
-    International Graduates Scheme (or its predecessor, the Science and Engineering Graduate Scheme)
-    Business and Commercial work permit (except multiple entry work permits)
-    Sports and Entertainment work permit (except multiple entry work permits)

You can also switch to a Tier 2 (General) visa if you’re:

-    a dependent partner of someone with a Tier 4 visa
-    a Jewish agency employee
-    operational ground staff of an overseas-owned airline
-    a minister of religion, missionary or member of a religious order
-    an overseas qualified nurse or midwife
-    writing up a thesis
-    a postgraduate doctor or dentist
-    a representative of an overseas business
-    a representative of an overseas newspaper, news agency or broadcasting organisation
-    a student union sabbatical officer

You must leave the UK and make your Tier 2 (General) application from abroad if you’re not in any of these categories.


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