Marriage visitor visa with EU national

Hi all,

I'm an American engaged to a French man who has been living and working in the UK for two years. I used to live in France (where we met one year ago), but my visa has expired and I am living back in the US now. We want to marry in the UK, but are not sure if we qualify for a marriage visitor visa.

My plan is to apply for the marriage visitor visa, come to the UK, marry my fiance and then return to the U.S. to apply for an EEA family permit.

However, I've read that, to be approved for the marriage visitor visa, you have to have plans to settle outside the UK. Since we plan to settle in the UK after I obtain the EEA family permit, would this be grounds for them to deny me the marriage visitor visa?

I am currently unemployed and my fiance has a very good job, this is why it makes sense for us to marry in the UK where he lives (and won't have to take any time off of work) and not in the US.

Any advice or similar experience would be really helpful.

Thanks!
Chelsea

My plan is to apply for the marriage visitor visa, come to the UK, marry my fiance and then return to the U.S. to apply for an EEA family permit.

Sounds good to me.

However, I've read that, to be approved for the marriage visitor visa, you have to have plans to settle outside the UK. Since we plan to settle in the UK after I obtain the EEA family permit, would this be grounds for them to deny me the marriage visitor visa?

What you need to show for the marriage visitor visa is that you are only visiting and that you plan to LEAVE the UK after the wedding.

Not that you necessarily plan to settle together outside the UK, but that YOU are just a visitor and will leave and go back to the US, and that you won't try to stay in the UK with him.

It's not a problem if you go back to the US and then apply for the EEA Family Permit, but what you need to show for the Marriage Visitor Visa is that you have a life (ideally a home and job) to return to in the US, which means that you will leave the UK after the wedding and won't try to stay in the UK illegally.

I am currently unemployed and my fiance has a very good job, this is why it makes sense for us to marry in the UK where he lives (and won't have to take any time off of work) and not in the US.

Honestly, it's usually easier to marry in the US because he doesn't need a visa to marry there and there's usually no specific waiting period in order to marry - maybe 24-48 hours at most, but not usually any more than that, so in theory he could come to the US to marry you and only need to take a couple of days off work.

However, marrying in the UK involves applying for a marriage visitor visa, showing you are just visiting and are not planning to live in the UK, and you have to be in the UK for a minimum of 22 days before you can marry (7 days before you are allowed to give notice and another 15 days after that before you can marry).

For the marriage visitor visa, you will need to show:

- that you will leave the UK within 6 months (evidence of a possible flight itinerary that you plan to book
- that you have enough money to support yourself without working for the length of your trip
- that you have evidence of plans to marry (a provisional booking, or just correspondence with the church or registry office regarding possible dates)
- that you have ties to the US that you must return to:
   - a job in the US (a letter from your employer giving you time off and stating what date you will be back at work)
   - a home in the US that you are maintaining (rental agreement, mortgage statements etc.)
   - any other ties in the US that you might return for (official appointments, events or interviews, family members you take care of etc.)

I was of the impression that the Marriage Visitors Visa was really more for those marrying UK nationals?

Is there a reason why she couldn't just get the EEA FP now, fly to the UK and get married there?  Or he flies to the US, they marry, and then she applies for the FP from the US based on their marriage and longevity of relationship?  I mean it only takes a week to get the FP, they could be on honeymoon in the US while waiting for it to show up.

I was of the impression that the Marriage Visitors Visa was really more for those marrying UK nationals?

No, it's for anyone who wishes to marry in the UK on a visit, but isn't a UK/EEA citizen and doesn't have a visa to live in the UK. If neither of the couple has permission to live in the UK, then they BOTH need to apply for Marriage Visitor Visas.

For example, a US couple might want to have a destination wedding in the UK because they've always wanted to marry in a Scottish castle... so, despite what is often depicted in TV and film, they need marriage visitor visas in order to be able to do it.

Or if, say, Brad and Angelina had wanted to marry in the UK instead of in France, they would have needed to apply for Marriage Visitor Visas in order to do it.

Every country has their own laws on whether visitors need a visa to marry there or not. In the US, a visitor does not need a special to marry, so in that respect, it can be easier to marry there.

Is there a reason why she couldn't just get the EEA FP now, fly to the UK and get married there?

Because they don't qualify to apply for an EEA FP yet. They have to be married before they can apply for it.

The only way to qualify for the EEA FP without being married is if they are unmarried partners who have been legally living together in the same country for at least 2 years (24 consecutive months).
 

Or he flies to the US, they marry, and then she applies for the FP from the US based on their marriage and longevity of relationship?I mean it only takes a week to get the FP, they could be on honeymoon in the US while waiting for it to show up.

Yes, that was my suggestion - if he flies to the US, they can marry within a couple of days and apply for the FP right after. The OP's reason for not wishing to do this is that her fiance would have to take time off work for the trip to the US.

The longevity of relationship is irrelevant in this case because they haven't been living together for at least 2 years - so it's the marriage certificate that is important.

Isn't it still the case that people going through the EEA route don't need to leave in order to apply for the residence card? I'm sure there have been people who have married on a visitor visa and then just stayed and applied for EEA2, because for EEA family members the rights are automatic upon marriage.

Isn't it still the case that people going through the EEA route don't need to leave in order to apply for the residence card? I'm sure there have been people who have married on a visitor visa and then just stayed and applied for EEA2, because for EEA family members the rights are automatic upon marriage.

Yes, that's still true, although it's not really ideal as you still need to show you intend to leave the UK after the wedding in order to get the Marriage Visitor Visa, and if you do apply for EEA2 as a visitor, you will still be under visitor visa rules until the residence card has been processed as you won't have anything official showing your immigration status as the family member of an EEA citizen, meaning no work, no NHS, no benefits.

But if you leave the UK and apply for the EEA FP, you can come back to the UK and work immediately as well as access the NHS and UK benefits, even while the EEA2 is processing.

Just remembered though that you don't actually need to apply for the EEA FP from the US, it can be applied for from any country, even if you don't live there... although applying from the US may be quicker - it can be processed within a week or so (maybe less with priority processing) in NYC, while it could potentially take weeks or months from another country, depending on the processing times there.

Yes, that's still true, although it's not really ideal as you still need to show you intend to leave the UK after the wedding in order to get the Marriage Visitor Visa, and if you do apply for EEA2 as a visitor, you will still be under visitor visa rules until the residence card has been processed as you won't have anything official showing your immigration status as the family member of an EEA citizen, meaning no work, no NHS, no benefits.

I really don't think this is correct. As soon as they are married, the rights transfer automatically, and the only point of the EEA2 application is to have proof of the rights rather than the rights themselves. Therefore they would be under EEA rules, not visitor visa rules, as soon as the marriage is official. They also don't have to wait for the card itself, as the Certificate of Application is enough to prove the rights until the card arrives. Yes, this can take a while and getting the FP outside the UK first can speed things up, but in terms of EU regulations, the directive is quite clear that the rights are automatic regardless of how you entered the country (with some grey area for illegal entry of course).

Thank you guys for all the info!

After reading everything on here, we're now leaning towards a quick wedding in the US and then applying for the family permit while I'm in the US.

However, I also like the idea of entering the UK on a tourist visa after the wedding and applying for the family permit there so that we don't have to spend too much time apart (and I can begin networking and job searching in preparation for when I'll be allowed to work). The only problem is that I've spent a lot of time in the UK over the past year and (even though I would still be technically allowed three more months on the tourist visa) and am worried they might reject me at the border (on the grounds that I may be trying to live there on a tourist visa). Is this something I really have to worry about or am I being a bit paranoid?

Your plan is good - seriously though, the FP in the US takes maybe 5 days (once you have all your documentation and fingerprints done) and will give you 6 months entry and right to work right off.  Its not a hassle at all, and all you need really is the marriage certificate, some evidence of your relationship, and both of your passports (doing this from memory, you may want to check, but its really easy).  Applying for the EEA 2 in the UK will take up to (and exceeding) 6 months in some instances, meaning that you can be in limbo for that long.  If you are here on a visitors visa then that makes everything murky.  You have a right to the FP so you may as well spend the extra few days in the US to eliminate a lot of hassle from immigration and job searching down the road.  Time it right and you won't spend any time apart from your hubby.

Also, I am not sure, but I don't think you can switch in the UK from a visitor visa to the EEA2 or, if you tried that, your relationship could come under undue scrutiny.  Make it easy on yourself:  marry in the US, apply for the EEA FP in the US, come back to the UK and enter on the FP, apply for EEA2.  No costs other than the flights to the US.  Et voila!

Given how much you have been in the UK this year, I would absolutely not try and reenter on a visitors visa, regardless of your family status with an EU citizen.  Do not give the UK any opportunity to find a reason to reject you or to muddy your immigration record.  Also, just to clarify, there are two parts to the EEA Family Permit, which is somewhat confusing.  There is the EEA FP for 6 months that you apply for (as noted above) outside the UK.  Once you are here then you can apply for the EEA2 from within the UK, which grants you 5 years living and working rights in the UK, so long as you continue to be married to an EU citizen who is exercising treaty rights (has a job, looking for a job, etc).  Its really a matter of convenience so you don't have to keep renewing the FP every 6 months (requiring leaving the country).

Also, I am not sure, but I don't think you can switch in the UK from a visitor visa to the EEA2 or, if you tried that, your relationship could come under undue scrutiny.  Make it easy on yourself:  marry in the US, apply for the EEA FP in the US, come back to the UK and enter on the FP, apply for EEA2.  No costs other than the flights to the US.  Et voila!

No, it's perfectly fine to apply for the EEA2 while you are on a visitor visa, it's just that you might have some issues with proving your right to be in the UK and to be allowed to work/access NHS/benefits etc. while it is processing... because you will only have a visitor visa stamp/sticker in your passport which will say on it "No Work or Recourse to Public Funds".

In fact, family members of EEA citizens are the only people who CAN apply while in the UK as a visitor (because they already have the right to live in the UK anyway). However, if a visitor tried to switch to a UK visa instead, that would not be allowed, plus the EEA Certificate of Application letter which may or may not state your right to work.

Also, just to clarify, there are two parts to the EEA Family Permit, which is somewhat confusing.  There is the EEA FP for 6 months that you apply for (as noted above) outside the UK.  Once you are here then you can apply for the EEA2 from within the UK, which grants you 5 years living and working rights in the UK, so long as you continue to be married to an EU citizen who is exercising treaty rights (has a job, looking for a job, etc).  Its really a matter of convenience so you don't have to keep renewing the FP every 6 months (requiring leaving the country).

No, there's just one part to the family permit: the family permit.

The family permit just gets you into the UK to start with and then the EEA2 is a separate thing, which you apply for once you are in the UK. If you didn't apply for the EEA2 you would NOT have to keep renewing the FP because...

a) you only need it to ENTER the UK - if you don't leave the UK at all, then you don't need to apply for a new one.
and
b) you can't renew it from inside the UK anyway.

However, if you left the UK on vacation, you would have to re-apply for one from abroad each time you wanted to return to the UK... because you wouldn't have the EEA2 residence card to prove your immigration status.

Neither the FP or the EEA2 are actually required to live in the UK - you have the right to live and work in the UK regardless, it's just that without them, you may have trouble proving that right and being allowed back into the UK if you travel abroad.

Thanks so much for the info guys! This is really helpful!

Now I'm going to get the FP while in the US  and apply for the EA2 after I move to the UK. We will travel a lot so I think it's best to have the EA2.

Thanks again!

Also, when applying for the EEA family permit, do they require both passports or just mine?

Sorry, I see now that it was mentioned earlier that both passports are needed. But my fiance requires his to return to the UK. Do they keep his passport? Could he just send a photocopy? Do we both have to be present when applying for the family permit?

The US citizen's passport must be sent. The EEA citizen can either send their actual passport, or a certified copy of the photo page or a regular photocopy along with their birth certificate (some say just the photocopy is enough though).


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If you just want to do a quick wedding, Denmark is easy for foreigners to get married in. You can go over to Copenhagen for the weekend, get married and then come back with your marriage license (making sure to get an international one that's translated into English) and your husband's contract. You can get the family permit stamp at the border and then apply for the EEA2 when you get into the country. Cheaper than a flight to the US for your Fiance and it would take less time.