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Topic: grammar skills in the UK  (Read 3401 times)

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grammar skills in the UK
« on: December 04, 2015, 04:14:21 PM »
Out of curiosity, do "professional" British people adhere to any grammar rules?

This is the response I received from UKVisaImmigration:
"Further to our recent e-mail confirming the receipt of the application above we have not been able to locate an Appendix 2 with the documents provided."

Is it me, or is the sentence missing a comma?   :-X


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Re: grammar skills in the UK
« Reply #1 on: December 04, 2015, 04:17:31 PM »
Quoting my reply to your identical post in Chit Chat:

The sentence is missing a comma, yes, but are you really extrapolating from one missing punctuation mark in one e-mail that professional people in the UK don't follow grammar rules? Your question strikes me as bizarre. The answer is yes of course they do, but that errors are sometimes made and some people are more diligent about such things than others. Just like everywhere else in the world.
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Re: grammar skills in the UK
« Reply #2 on: December 04, 2015, 04:25:51 PM »
I have yet to come across a well written email response from UKVI, some Solicitors, Real Estate Agents... and the list goes on and on...

When I get an important email from an authoritative figure, and its in the same grammatical dysfunction that everyone else is getting, I can't help to wonder...

!!!!!!! the apple doesn't fall far from the tree!!!!!!!!!!!


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Re: grammar skills in the UK
« Reply #3 on: December 04, 2015, 06:37:23 PM »
Well I'm an English teacher and I count a minimum of seven errors of punctuation, lexis, capitalisation, and grammar in the post you've just made, does that mean I can infer that all Americans who post on forums have poor language skills? I'd argue that I can't even infer that you have poor language skills based on that information. Similarly, your correspondence with UKVI is nowhere near comprehensive enough to condemn all professional people in the UK. Furthermore, I'd wager that American professionals make exactly the same sort of minor errors in their e-mails, why automatically assume it's a British thing? It just seems an odd sort of thing to focus on and a strange conclusion to draw from limited data, that's all.
On s'envolera du même quai
Les yeux dans les mêmes reflets,
Pour cette vie et celle d'après
Tu seras mon unique projet.

Je t'aimais, je t'aime, et je t'aimerai.

--Francis Cabrel


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Re: grammar skills in the UK
« Reply #4 on: December 04, 2015, 07:15:02 PM »
does that mean I can infer that all Americans who post on forums have poor language skills?

You'll either be inferring it or implying it. I can't remember the difference.
I just hope that more people will ignore the fatalism of the argument that we are beyond repair. We are not beyond repair. We are never beyond repair. - AOC


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Re: grammar skills in the UK
« Reply #5 on: December 04, 2015, 07:24:12 PM »

You'll either be inferring it or implying it. I can't remember the difference.

Haha. To infer is to draw some conclusion from context or other indirect information within a statement or situation. To imply is to implant the indirect information in the statement in the first place.


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Re: grammar skills in the UK
« Reply #6 on: December 04, 2015, 07:46:35 PM »
I liked science better...... :) In fact......Music, PE, Art....just about anything but Language Arts.
Fred


Re: grammar skills in the UK
« Reply #7 on: December 04, 2015, 08:21:26 PM »
A professional email should have proper grammar, specially coming from the government.  Case closed.  its a rant category.  My opinion but clearly a fact that the British Home Office is incorrect with how they sent out emails.

Go ahead and scrutinize my chat jargon, but there is nothing more disgusting to get an email from the government written so poorly.  This isn't just an individual sending out the email, it is a canned message.  And frankly, it is a reflection of the British Government.

Even their website fails to have detailed and concise instructions.  Excuse me, but it doesn't take rocket science to put together a professionally written webpage. 

Again the apple does not fall far from the tree. British people love to say how smart they are, but their own gov't dims that perspective.






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Re: grammar skills in the UK
« Reply #8 on: December 04, 2015, 08:45:37 PM »
British people love to say how smart they are

Do we?!
I'd love to see you elaborate on this.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2015, 08:55:50 PM by Albatross »


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Re: grammar skills in the UK
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2015, 10:06:06 PM »
I've heard a lot more Americans say how wonderful they are than the British. Matter of opinion of course.....and depends on what you want to hear.

I do have to agree that there a lot of "official" supposedly important sites out there that could really use some proof reading/clarifying before posting.
Fred


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Re: grammar skills in the UK
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2015, 10:14:19 PM »
The only thing I will say on this one is that the grammar rules are different here in the UK. Commas are used differently, and (") are called speech marks and (') are quotation marks and when you use one or the other seems to have very little rhyme or reason. There are quite a few things I have had to learn in order to proof read correctly here. My British husband said that the comma you said is missing isn't required, it could just be added for readability.

Okay, in case anyone is wondering you only use (") when someone is actually speaking/a quotation, but sometimes people just use the single ones. You use (') for just about everything else. It's so weird.
The usual. American girl meets British guy. They fall into like, then into love. Then there was the big decision. The American traveled across the pond to join the Brit. And life was never the same again.


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Re: grammar skills in the UK
« Reply #11 on: December 08, 2015, 11:08:25 AM »
this is also a pet peeve of mine. i've never heard such worse grammar in my life. for dinner when people say, "getting an indian." grammatically, it makes no sense. we put "a" or "an" after a specific thing. "getting a pizza" makes sense. but to make it general, "getting an italian" makes it sound like you are going to eat an italian person. on the flip side, they also use specific terms for general things. an example of this is saying you are going to hoover the floor rather than the verb vacuuming. or calling a doctor's office surgery.

also, i think the british have a habit of shortening phrases which also makes things confusing. example, when someone is sick, saying "they're poorly."


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Re: grammar skills in the UK
« Reply #12 on: December 08, 2015, 11:33:36 AM »
Yes, but a lot of these things are particular to certain areas or dialects....

I've made my peace with things like "I was sat there in the hall" or "It was myself and my brother"....these things have come about as a result of pockets of linguistic development. And a lot of people, if not most, code shift.....using different versions of English for different occasions.

For a long time diminutives/baby talk really got my goat....brollie....brekkie.....'leccy....preggers...just that they seemed more trouble than saying the whole word. But somebody here on the boards straightened me out when I complained about the word "troll" being used for "internet abuser" instead of a sublime argument starter....and they reminded me that "troll" was once a grumpy dude under a bridge...

And as far as diminutives, what about "cookie" or "daddy"....

Some words still fascinate me. "Geezer," I say, has no American equal. "Mate" is very strange to me.....no one ever calls their banker "mate". No one calls their doctor "mate". When a guy calls me "mate" I wonder what that means....am I projecting something?

 
I just hope that more people will ignore the fatalism of the argument that we are beyond repair. We are not beyond repair. We are never beyond repair. - AOC


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Re: grammar skills in the UK
« Reply #13 on: December 08, 2015, 11:42:34 AM »
And too....we are all actively involved in changing the English language. I was on a fashion site and saw "Peak beard" and "Manbun" mentioned.
I just hope that more people will ignore the fatalism of the argument that we are beyond repair. We are not beyond repair. We are never beyond repair. - AOC


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Re: grammar skills in the UK
« Reply #14 on: December 08, 2015, 12:17:48 PM »
I think a lot has to do with the technology age and "text speak".  Professional grammar skills are going downhill worldwide as far as I can tell.  I don't think it's UK versus US.


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