Author Topic: Family of Five Preparing for the Big Move  (Read 710 times)

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Offline Sirius

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Re: Family of Five Preparing for the Big Move
« Reply #15 on: April 22, 2017, 06:01:47 PM »
That would be very very difficult to get. If they let all laborers and not just skilled ones, with private insurance and required then to pay the same taxes and limit how much money they can send out of the country, I fail to see the issue

I explained above why that is bad for a country.

Offline lyonaria

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Re: Family of Five Preparing for the Big Move
« Reply #16 on: April 22, 2017, 06:22:14 PM »
That would be very very difficult to get. If they let all laborers and not just skilled ones, with private insurance and required then to pay the same taxes and limit how much money they can send out of the country, I fail to see the issue
This makes me wonder, how would you 'limit how much money they can send out of the country?'

Because you can't tell people what they can and cannot do with their own money. They don't limit anything in the US, why should the UK do it?

The US is very limiting about visas as well, just not to the same levels as the UK.
The usual. American girl meets British guy. They fall into like, then into love. Then there was the big decision. The American traveled across the pond to join the Brit. And life was never the same again.

Offline -9intend0-

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Re: Family of Five Preparing for the Big Move
« Reply #17 on: April 22, 2017, 06:45:04 PM »
This makes me wonder, how would you 'limit how much money they can send out of the country?'

Because you can't tell people what they can and cannot do with their own money. They don't limit anything in the US, why should the UK do it?

The US is very limiting about visas as well, just not to the same levels as the UK.

Trust me, I don't for a second say that America is any better.

It's just an idea I had that would work better than the wall Trump wants. If people can only send, say, $200/month to other countries if they are working immigrants, that prevents people from siphoning money from the country and forces them to spend it in the country they earned it. But again, I'm not a politician for a reason lol

Offline lyonaria

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Re: Family of Five Preparing for the Big Move
« Reply #18 on: April 22, 2017, 06:56:14 PM »
Trust me, I don't for a second say that America is any better.

It's just an idea I had that would work better than the wall Trump wants. If people can only send, say, $200/month to other countries if they are working immigrants, that prevents people from siphoning money from the country and forces them to spend it in the country they earned it. But again, I'm not a politician for a reason lol

Yeah. You can't do that, we don't live under a totalitarian regime.
The usual. American girl meets British guy. They fall into like, then into love. Then there was the big decision. The American traveled across the pond to join the Brit. And life was never the same again.

Offline Dennis the Menace!!

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Re: Family of Five Preparing for the Big Move
« Reply #19 on: April 23, 2017, 05:42:00 PM »
Hi 9Intend0,

What you are mentioning so far on the thread, is exactly what those who have had an idea to move elsewhere have, but as yet haven't researched enough into actually making it happen. That's no bad thing at all, you have to begin somewhere!

When it comes to removing the 'romance' and looking at actual reality, you'll begin to understand what you've been told so far from the person you spoke with isn't accurate for the most part and indeed it 'sounds' from your description, he's believing alot of what the likes of the right wing media and what the popular, noisy members of it are incorrectly trying to make more of the population believe. You need to look past this massive recent smokescreen of utter and total BS and begin to see a more truthful and accurate picture.

The reason you can't easily just come here and work in the way you describe, to put it bluntly is that you've got no way to prove that. All the 'Unskilled Economic Migrants' say the same too, and for the most part, they are indeed hard working and take up the jobs many of the indigenous white British people think is beneath them. Those same people then moan and complain 'immigrants are stealing their jobs'. On the radio, LBC radio, a discussion was held and lots of employers called in to give their experience. A lady running a Hotel/larger B&B spoke and was PLEADING on national radio for local school leavers, Summer in between university students and those looking for a job to apply. She mentioned local British people would last 5 minutes and then just leave, whilst alot of the EU migrants would work hard and of course stay. Not to say 'ALL' Brits are like that, but I also got quite similar when we used to employ at our Business too.

Skilled immigration is where the 'right wing' will also say 'oh doctors, scientists, engineers' etc can all come in, we're not saying they can't come in' and then you hear from people who've done exactly that, only to have this 'current' of the UK's deep set racism bubble up further and now you get many of those thinking to leave. Some of my own relatives have done that, they are extremely highly skilled Consultant level Medical specialists, and were here for perhaps 2/3 years and.. left, for the USA. The main issues? a combination of attitude of the UK, patients blatantly telling them they want them to go away and that they want a White Doctor, lots of red tape within the NHS, a year my cousins wife was told she wouldn't be paid a penny yet had to work full time in order to gain UK experience and one big bug ber was when their first son was born here, he was not recognised as 'British' - I think this was a 'clause' for visa's for highly skilled medical staff from India.

On the other hand, I've seen many many Americans come here via work/business and are permanently settled, there's a big number here on this forum as well of course - however for the 'most' part, it's those who've moved over via getting married.

The UK has plenty of teachers already, there's problems on the whole with retaining a significant proportion of them due to problems within the profession/Schools etc and the level of stress and unruly behaved kids. With an American accent, you'd likely experience 'some level' of negativity from the kids as you'd be 'different'. Keep in mind also the 'Teaching' profession is MASSIVELY undervalued in the UK, pay grades aren't good really and the work life balance is similarly quite bad. Plenty of course do stick through it don't get me wrong, but you've really got to LOVE the profession and be totally passionate about it in order to be and try to progress in this sector.

To get work level visa's to come here, you'll need to be exceptional and/or in high demand for that skill/role and demand for it will need to be high. To get that level of experience and knowledge usually means at least a number of years in the US within a job doing it. This is how 'most' of those here made it across. High level and senior to Board Level executives are the main types who come over. I suspect, you are relatively young along with your sisters, so assuming that you are, it's going to be unlikely you'd be able to move over using your current or next few years of experience. Another reason is the expense and extra work a UK company needs to do in order to hire a highly skilled foreign national and you'll tend to find it's the upper and higher levels of corporates who can and will do this - they'll be looking at those senior execs level only, not recent graduates. Again, that said, some companies indeed will look to more junior staff, but it'll be very specific for the most part.

As Lyonaria mentions, we don't live in a Totalitarian regime, so quickly remove the thought you have about limiting the amount of money anyone can send to another country!! People move large amounts of money from here to all over the world on a personal level, to give you an idea, a husband of an American couple here, where she was a VERY high executive for a corporate, rented a house for over £20,000/month back in 2007'ish. He purchased some items from our business and I went over to deliver and I got talking to him. Everything was paid for by the corporate, rent, ultilies, fuel, kids private schooling, cars, the works. The massive salary the wife earnt went on luxuries for the most part as all their main living costs were already paid. a big amount would go back to the USA, lets just say $200 would be the amount sent back every few minutes!

My advice to you (assuming indeed you are relatively young, along with your sisters) would be to get yourselves into good careers in your chosen industry sectors and look to advance as quickly as you can in terms of experience and jobs. In perhaps 5+ years time, look to see more of moving abroad, and not just the UK. In that time, of course, if anything comes up that looks promising to allow one of you to move and experience another country to live in, then take it. By that time also, many people are counting down the days already, that Chump guy won't be in power and there'll be a swing back to a good president that's looking outwards to the rest of the world and to be more inclusive and open to new opportunities.

Please don't take the above as trying to put you off, I've met many people who have come over with the companies I worked at who are here still so it can be done. I just feel you need to see the realities asap rather than the 'romance' that you are currently in. Only then can you make more accurate and effective decisions.

Cheers, DtM! West London & Slough UK!

Offline physicskate

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Re: Family of Five Preparing for the Big Move
« Reply #20 on: April 23, 2017, 06:13:08 PM »
That would be very very difficult to get. If they let all laborers and not just skilled ones, with private insurance and required then to pay the same taxes and limit how much money they can send out of the country, I fail to see the issue

Essentially, xenophobia and a limit of infrastructure are the main issues...
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12/05/16: Citizenship ceremony!

Offline Sirius

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Re: Family of Five Preparing for the Big Move
« Reply #21 on: April 24, 2017, 12:17:06 PM »
Quote from: Dennis the Menace!! link=topic=90265.msg1168925#msg1168925
alot of the EU migrants would work hard and of course stay.

Under the 2004 Directive of Free Movement of people, they have to work if they want a right to reside in another member state. Stop working, then they are not in the UK legally and can be removed. Although the EU says that only has to be a few hours a week before they can claim benefits from that country (if that country pays in work beneftis). Otherwise they must be self sufficient and have a Comprehensive Sickness Policy and not take any benefits from that member state.

There never was a shortage of low skilled workers as the UK has always had visas for  these, for citizens of any country, the Tier 3 visa (closed because of free movement). Plus there still is the Tier 5 Youth Mobility visas. Like all UK Tier work visas, they cannot have any UK benefits. It's the latter of these, the Youth Mobilty visas, that the UK are thinking they might offer to EU citizens after Brexit. With this Tier 5, they are only for the young who don't have children, no family can come with them, no benefits, for a limited time only and will not lead to settlement. Or I guess they could open up the Tier 3 again, for any citizens?

Plus there was also the open door policy to citizens of Commonwealth countries, that ended with the Immigration Act 1971 because too many were arriving. As said above, for countries with an economy based on free trade, an oversupply of workers arriving, drives down wages etc.


I used to live near a lot of tomato greenhouses and the pickers during term time were usually mothers, to increase their family income (the Tax Credits beneifit wasn't invented until about 2004 and is ending under the Welfare Reform Acts). During the holidays, the pickers were the university students. Students have never been allowed benefits. The wages were much highter then for these, than the national minimum wage they pay now, due to this supply and demand.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2017, 12:51:42 PM by Sirius »

Offline physicskate

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Re: Family of Five Preparing for the Big Move
« Reply #22 on: April 24, 2017, 06:39:14 PM »

I thought since the introduction of the Tier system circa 2007/8, Tier 3 had never actually been open! Though it does exist... but again, because of the oversupply of (local and non-local) low skilled workers...
2004-2008: Student Visa
2008-2010: Tier 1 PSW
2010-2011: Tier 4
2011-2014: Tier 2
2013-2016: New Tier 2 (changed jobs)
16/12/15: SET (LR) successful! - It's been a long road...
12/05/16: Citizenship ceremony!

Offline ksand24

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Re: Family of Five Preparing for the Big Move
« Reply #23 on: April 24, 2017, 09:27:30 PM »
I thought since the introduction of the Tier system circa 2007/8, Tier 3 had never actually been open! Though it does exist... but again, because of the oversupply of (local and non-local) low skilled workers...

Yeah, I recall seeing the Tier 3 mentioned in passing back when they first introduced the Tier visa system, but I've never heard of it actually being an available visa option.

From Wikipedia:

Quote
Tier 3
(Never used)


Tier 3 was originally designed for low-skilled workers filling specific temporary labour shortages, however it is currently suspended by the UK Government. A strong supply of labour from the European Economic Area (EEA), members of which do not require visas to work in the UK, has meant it has never been required since the points-based system was implemented in 2008.

Offline Sirius

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Re: Family of Five Preparing for the Big Move
« Reply #24 on: April 26, 2017, 09:55:18 AM »
Yeah, I recall seeing the Tier 3 mentioned in passing back when they first introduced the Tier visa system, but I've never heard of it actually being an available visa option.

Yep, by the time all the Tier points based visas worked their way through parliament, the Tier 3 visa for the low skilled, was set to come in about 2008.
However the government at the time, didn't realise that 1 in 4 EEA citizens would use the Free Movement Directive to move to the UK and they didn't bring in a cap on numbers from some EU countries as the other popular EU countries had done. The Tier 3 visa was therefore over before it had begun. 

This is why there is a gap in these point based Tier visas now. We still have Tier 1, Tier 2, Tier 4 and Tier 5.


But as the Tier 3 went through parliament but just wasn't implemented, I assume it could be opened again? Many Statutory laws are either implemented straight away, at a later date, or not. Hence why I mentioned it above with Brexit. Although the Foreign Secretay seems to favour a type of Tier 5 Youth Mobiltiy visa instead for the low skilled.


« Last Edit: April 26, 2017, 12:57:04 PM by Sirius »