Newbie - Whirlwind Romance - Best Options for her moving to UK

Hi all - will try to give the most useful facts here.

>> I'm from the UK, own my own business.
>> Met (now fiance) online 13th July, I visited US, engaged 8th Aug...
>> So no time to build up lots of evidence/bills etc
>> She wants to move to the UK asap
>> We're both practical people and are looking at whether getting married in the US or UK will have any particular pros and cons / speed things up etc?
>> I have my own Ltd Co business for potential sponsorship
>> I have my own property in the UK
>> She does not have a property to consider but has personal effects in storage in the US
>> In the interim waiting game, is there anything to be gained from her building up 'time spent' in the UK as a normal visitor (although with my business it's probably easier for me to spend chunks of time in the US)?

So am really looking for some kind of 'process map' or 'step a, b, c etc' which may well already be a sticky here but I could not find it. I'll even consider advisory services if they help to expedite things.

Many thanks for reading.

P.S. Until I found this forum, my question was receiving some relationship advice, which i'm truly not looking for. Apologies that I felt it necessary to mention this

Welcome to the forum .

Getting married in the US is easier because it saves on one visa, and means there's no real waiting period. Getting married in the UK on a fiance visa means her being resident in the UK for 7 days before giving notice to marry, and then waiting at least 28 days from giving notice before you can marry (this could be extended to 70 days if she has a visa while UKVI check the relationship is genuine, but hopefully this wouldn't happen if she already had a fiance visa).

Since your relationship is very new, it might be better to go the fiance visa route, as that would give you up to 6 months together in the UK before getting married, so you could spend more time together first.

Alternatively, it could well be a better idea to hold off on marriage for now and spend some time visiting each other in the US and the UK... that would allow you to make sure you're happy together and also to strengthen your relationship... you would then be able to show stronger evidence for a future fiance or spousal visa, to show you've been visiting each other and communicating regularly.

From what you mention, it sounds like you could meet the financial and accommodation requirements for sponsoring a fiance or spousal visa for her.
However, self-employment is a tricky category to get right, as there are lots of documents required and if even one is missing, the visa could be refused.

How long have you been self-employed?
You would need to be able to show earnings of either:
Category E: £18,600 in total before tax but after expenses for the last full financial year
or
Category F: an average of £18,600 per year before tax but after expenses in the last 2 full financial years

Thanks - yes realising that short time spent is a disadvantage (re perceived visa scam among other things)

So you suggest step 1 as marriage in the US being easier, thanks. I also take on board your comments re UK fiance visa. That also sounds sensible.

Re 'self employment' it's actually a Limited co so I'm an 'employee' (albeit of my own business), which turns over more than the requirements, but I only pay myself the minimum for UK tax purposes.

You asked about steps to take, and my advice would be:

- Spend the next few months communicating over the phone/email/messages, and save your call/message logs
- Visit each other when you can in that time and spend some time together to really get to know each other. If she hasn't visited the UK before, she'll want to see if she actually likes the UK. Also, living in a new country can be very different to just visiting, so she would need to make sure she could be happy here.
- start thinking about whether you seriously want to get married and settle in the UK together.
- start looking into the visa application process

Marrying in the UK
- if you decide to marry in the UK, she would need to apply for a 6-month fiance visa, to marry within those 6 months
- the fiance visa currently costs £1,464
- she would not be allowed to work or study or use the NHS for free (so she would need health insurance or she will be charged 150% of the bill for treatment)
- you marry in the UK within the 6 months and then apply for an FLR(M) visa extension for her to stay
- the FLR(M) costs £993 + £500 IHS surcharge (which allows her to use the NHS for 'free')
- once she has the 30-month FLR(M), she can work, study and use the NHS for free
- she will need to apply for a second 30-month FLR(M) just before the first one expires
- after 5 years on FLR(M), she can apply for ILR (permanent residence)

Marrying in the US
- you fly to the US and get married
- she applies for a 33-month spousal visa to move to the UK
- the spousal visa costs £1,464 + £600 IHS surcharge
- once she has the visa, she can work, study and use the NHS immediately
- after 30 months in the UK, she applies for FLR(M)
- after 5 years in the UK, she can apply for ILR

Also, the costs of visas keep rising, so you would need to budget approximately £10,000 in visa fees over the next 5/6 years.

Current prices:
Fiance visa: £1,464 (plus £551 for priority processing if you choose to use it)
Spousal visa: £2,064 (plus £551 for priority processing if you choose to use it)
FLR(M) visa: £1,493 (plus £590 for an in-person, same-day decision)
ILR: £2,297 (plus £590 for an in-person, same-day decision)
UK citizenship after gaining ILR: £1,282

However, the visa prices rise every March/April and they are currently approved to rise to a maximum of £3,250 by 2020, but they could go higher after that.

This is all super stuff, many thanks

Re 'self employment' it's actually a Limited co so I'm an 'employee' (albeit of my own business), which turns over more than the requirements, but I only pay myself the minimum for UK tax purposes.

That could be an issue for the visa requirements.

If you actually pay yourself less than £18,600 per year, you would likely not be able to sponsor her visa, as you need to be able to show at least the equivalent of £18,600 annual 'salary' going into your bank account.

Assuming your company tax year is April to April, and you haven't yet been paying yourself the equivalent of £18,600 per year, you would need to start doing that now. So you would have to wait until you have a full financial tax year of income at that level going into your bank account before applying, i.e. it could be April 2019 before she can qualify to apply for a fiance or spousal visa.

If your company has a different tax year (as defined by the accounting year on the CT600), then you would need to make sure you have been paying yourself at least £18,600 for a full tax year before she can apply for a fiance or spousal visa

If you haven't already, have a read through Appendix FM 1.7 Financial Requirements and Appendix FM-SE Specified Evidence:
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/636618/Appendix_FM_1_7_Financial_Requirement_Final.pdf

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/immigration-rules/immigration-rules-appendix-fm-se-family-members-specified-evidence

This is all super stuff, many thanks

No problem .

Maybe if the difference between what I pay myself as salary and what i pay myself as 'dividends' will provide the necessary £18600, but will have to evaluate that - many thanks

Maybe if the difference between what I pay myself as salary and what i pay myself as 'dividends' will provide the necessary £18600, but will have to evaluate that - many thanks

Yeah, I don't know all the ins and outs of the self-employment income requirement myself, so it would be something to look into.

While you're getting to grips with the financial requirements (which it sounds like you may not currently meet - not sure how dividends are treated. The whole point of them is to increase the tax you pay so that you wouldn't be able to claim benefits etc... also you would have to meet the requirements at each visa application, but her income could count when she applies for renewal at the half way mark and for her ILR application), spend some time gathering evidence of your relationship. If you marry in the US, that would provide some good evidence (remember arranged marriages are allowed so it is not always required to have years and years of contact).

But it might be a better idea to apply for a fiance visa so that you both have a bit of time to see how the relationship goes before marrying, but more importantly to give your fiance a better feel for life in the UK before marriage. Especially as she hasn't been visiting you over the course of a few years, she might have a different idea of what it will be like to what it is actually like. Life in the UK does not suit everyone - there are a few threads on here about Americans experience culture shock, dislike of life here and all sorts. Some of us acclimate very well but you never know which category you will fall into until it all becomes real!

Sorry for my rambling... Normally I can be a bit more concise but summer for teachers tends to turn off our brains!

Welcome to the forums! 

I definitely echo what previous people have said about her visiting the UK before potentially making the move.  I've known people (both on this forum and in real life) who moved from the US thinking they would adore the UK, and ended up having a really difficult time once they got here (some to the point where they moved back to the US).   

I spent years visiting the UK to spend time with my other half before getting married and making the move, and even so, I encountered a few rough patches adjusting to life over here once I moved over.  Looking back, if I hadn't spent some time here as a visitor beforehand, I think I would have had an even harder time.  There are a surprising many things that you have to get used to in the UK that are different from the US, and I completely advocate getting a taste of the UK before moving over if you've never been before.

Welcome aboard!

Definitely, have her visit in the UK. She can stay for up to six months as a visitor so maybe a nice month long holiday would be a good way for her to dip her toe in the UK water.

Though we both speak English, life in the US is vastly different than life in the UK. Small things can make a large difference. Like not having your favourite brands in the store. For me, it's the freaking walking everywhere. Though great for my legs, it took me years to get used to not driving everywhere.

When you decide to get married, definitely do it in the US. It's cheaper, faster, and easier. I did the UK route, and I will tell you right now- I wish I had done the US route for the marriage certificate.

After you get the piece of paper, leave it with her as she will need it for her spousal visa should you decide to go down that route. Then, you just got to get all the financial documents and other bits and pieces.

P.S. Until I found this forum, my question was receiving some relationship advice, which i'm truly not looking for. Apologies that I felt it necessary to mention this

Not relationship advice, honestly, but I think a prenup would be a good idea, to protect both of you. 

While you're getting to grips with the financial requirements (which it sounds like you may not currently meet - not sure how dividends are treated.

I was just having another read of the guidance (I really do live the high life), and it seems as though dividends are treated under Category C as non-employment income and can be included/ counted in some way/shape/form.

I was just having another read of the guidance (I really do live the high life), and it seems as though dividends are treated under Category C as non-employment income and can be included/ counted in some way/shape/form.

It seems dividends can be used as part of self-employment income as the Director of a Limited Company (page 64 of Appendix FM 1.7):

(c) Where the person is listed as a director of the company and receives a salary from the company, all of the following documents must also be provided:

(i) Payslips and P60 (if issued) covering the same period as the Company Tax Return CT600.

(ii) Personal bank statements covering the same 12-month period as the Company Tax Return CT600 showing that the salary as a director was paid into an account in the name of the person or in the name of the person and their partner jointly.

(d) Where the person receives dividends from the company, all of the following documents must also be provided:

(i) Dividend vouchers for all dividends declared in favour of the person during or in respect of the period covered by the Company Tax Return CT600 showing the company’s and the person’s details with the person’s net dividend amount and tax credit

(ii) Personal bank statement(s) showing that those dividends were paid into an account in the name of the person or in the name of the person and their partner jointly.

Small things can make a large difference.

This!  Two words:  supermarket meltdown