Denied Visit Visa and Prospective Student

The general ethos of UKY reflects the notion of not playing it as close to the knuckle as you are. 

You have received some good advice so far, but at this point the best advice is to ask your lawyer who's going to explain away your prior refusal what's the effect of adding a bounce into the picture.  For a prospective student app, indeed.

I haven't responded before because, as you have a lawyer, you really should listen to her.  There is nothing worse than giving someone advice as an experienced legal professional and then having her ignore you.

However, I have to agree with everyone else here.  if you were bounced before, you'll be bounced again.  I am afraid that if I were the IO, I wouldn't believe that you don't intend to settle.  You are much better off applying for the prospective student visa.  At least if you do that and are refused you won't have to go all the way to the UK to find out.

Oh, and as for the 'intent to leave' clause - that is still in place for student visas, whether degree level or not.  It's in the rules.


Vicky

Hello All,

I am sorry for not posting for a while. As you probably all sensed from my previous posts, I played it close to the knuckle and flew over with my boyfriend (he came to the US for 5 days first), and miraculously got back in (coded entry valid till return flight) for my interview and trip to Italy in May, with a flight booked back to the US for June 9th. I received a verbal warning, though, and the only thing that saved me was the interview letter, and I know my boyfriend being there with me at the desk helped a lot. On the way back in from Italy yesterday, it was even harsher (totally different minded IO) who let me in (coded entry again, valid till June 9) after an hour waiting to one side, and checking all my information (including obtaining a copy of my visa refusal).

No more visa waiver for me, ever again. That was always the plan though, and I know how lucky I am to have even made it back at all this last time.

Unfortunately, I was not offered a place at Bristol following the interview. Both of us were gutted because we now have to give up plans (for a year at least) of doing our PGCE teaching certification together, and he doesn't want to do his without me so is going to try to defer his place.

More determined than ever to be together here, we are trying to prepare a fiance visa application before I leave on Monday, to apply ASAP once I'm home. I am wondering two things:
       1) *If* I am confident that I have enough documentation (ie year's worth of his bank statements, payslips, my savings statements, parents payslips, accounts, savings and letter of support, tenancy agreement, letter from landlord saying I am allowed to stay with him in his exclusively occupied *room*, surveyor's report of property, evidence of our respective identities and pics, letters, ticket stubs and letters from friends) DO I NEED A SOLICITOR to 'explain away' the previous refusal? Some of the solicitors I've spoken with feel confident about my application but are talking £1500-2200!!!
     
      2) Would it be a safer bet immigration-wise to get married at a courthouse in the states and go for the spousal visa outright?

I know I should've started this process earlier rather than flying back on the visa waiver first (which could've ended in disaster), but we just weren't ready for it until now.

As always, I really do appreciate any advice you guys may have (and I think I am in a much more receptive state for it at this point).

Thank you all for reading!!!!!!!

Diana

 Some of the solicitors I've spoken with feel confident about my application but are talking £1500-2200!!!
     
     

 

Wow.  You obviously haven't spoken to me!  Please do PM me if you want to discuss this - I am much more reasonable, and give UK Yankee discounts!  Plus, if I think you don't need me, I'll let you know.

But well done for beating the odds and scraping your way back in!  Sometimes risk taking pays off!

Vicky

Diana, I'm glad it worked out for you, but wow, man that was tight and could have been a disaster.  But yay for it working!!  But sorry about the school thing too- that's a real bummer.

I don't have a lot of advice for you on the fiance visa, but it does sound like a good plan.   Read through some of the fiance visa posts to make sure you have enough documentation and prove everything you have to.  Given the complexity of your situation, a solicitor may help- but hopefully vicky will be along to offer advice

Ooops- vicky- x-posted! ;-P

Thanks Vicky and phatbeetle. I know, I got so lucky.
Vicky, I *think* my pm to you went through, although I didn't have it checked to save to my outbox so there's no way of knowing.

Just gathering as much info as possible at this point, will keep everyone posted.

Diana ;-)

Got the PM - thanks.  Just sent you an e-mail.

Vicky

Hi Everyone,

Update is that I sent off fiance visa app (in a nice organized binder), rec'd email from consulate on Tuesday July 1st stating the docs were rec'd, further enquiries were being made and to allow up to 20 days!!!

So meanwhile I am trying to go over every possible case scenario in my head for why they might deny me, and rather than bombard poor Vicky (the Lovely & Amazing) with every little neurotic concern I have, let me ask you guys for your opinions (& reassurance!!!!).

Here is a list of what I sent in:
Section I: Application
1. Application with photo and biometrics form
2. Diana's statement
3. Duncan's statement
4. My passport & birth certificate
5. Duncan's passport
6. Address of previous visit visa refusal with original refusal attached
7. Information re my speeding ticket

Section II: Maintenance & Accommodation Key Documents
We are able to easily support ourselves on his salary of £2,095 pcm after tax and my savings of £5,023. We are the sole occupants of a double room (162.5 sq ft) in a 3 bedroom house with 2 other occupants.
1. Statement summarizing our assets & monthly budget (£2,723 combined monthly assets vs. £1,430 fixed expenses)
2. Duncan's payslips (6 mos), bank statements (3 mos), savings & credit card statements
3. Bank certified printout of my current account & bank affidavit confirming these funds
4. Previous savings account statements
5. Signed parental statement confirming their $10,000 gift, as well as certified copies of the withdrawal and deposit slips & parents' bank statements evidencing both the origination & transfer of funds.
6. Signed joint tenancy agreement & pictures as proof of our accomodation. 
7. Duncan's current employment contract with Ryobi
8. Statement & documents regarding my employability after we are wed
9. Statement confirming Dunc's student loans are paid in full
10. Duncan's previous tenancy agreements & employment contract

Section III: Relationship & Wedding Plans
1. Statements from my father, his mother, our friends, and his best friend's parents
2. Statement of preliminary wedding plans & related documents
3. Pictures of us, cards, flights to see each other, phone bill, email screen shots.

My biggest two worries are this:
1) British immigration doesn't like me. Last 3 entry stamps were coded; on the first notes were recorded about my visiting my b/f, the second IO (entering in May with Duncan) took notes about my PGCE interview AND my boyfriend, and the third (again with Dunc on returning from Italy, when the woman almost didn't let me in and put a little 'W' for warning next to my coded entry) made extensive notes, on my failed PGCE interview & the fact that I will be returning home to apply for a fiance visa, being now engaged.

So, my worry is that I didn't mention the PGCE interview in my fiance app, though I did mention eventual wish to become a teacher. Deception? Thought it irrelevant and didn't want to cloud their view of my intentions to be with Duncan. Also, have a feeling they will be suspicious of me having been a 'genuine' visitor, especially for the initial 6-month chunk last year. Can they deny me a visa because they don't like my piss-taking American flippancy, basically because they don't like how I've played their system?
Christ, I'm really driving myself nuts over here.

2)Also, and Vicky has already addressed this to me but I am still compulsively obsessing over it, the 3 bank statements for Dunc show overdraft, though explained and ending with positive balance for the last two of 980(May 9th) & 1200 (June 9th). Also enclosed a transaction history from June 23-June 30, showing a 300 GBP golf purchase, and only 85 pence left over before 2095 gbp salary credit. Suspicious gap between June 9th & June 23rd? Totally screwed with the 85 p thing? His overdraft is fixed, btw. We explained that using it was due to excessive recreational spending, itemized transactions and budget demonstrate this as well. Can they deny us, for being poor money managers even though we are able to support ourselves? 

Please offer any opinions and soothing words, I just can't imagine they will issue the visa as this would be the just and humane outcome; rather I think they will do everything in their power to twist my case, pick every hole they can, and come up with some fluffy, elaborately worded refusal, as happened with the visitor visa. I know I fundamentally didn't qualify for that, having an obvious intent to stay in the UK long-term, which might explain their motivation to pick holes in the first place, but I am afraid that even though I do qualify as a fiance and my intentions are now in line with my application, they will still seek to screw me in some way, being heartless. Paranoia?

Thanks to all who had the patience for reading the latest chapter in my novel ;-) It really does make me feel better to write it all down, though.

Diana