UK Entry Refusal

There have been previous threads about this... From what I have read elsewhere the airline most likely used her return ticket to remove her from the UK. She would have to call the airline and see. But I'm 99% positive that she'll find that she has no unused portion of her ticket.

http://talk.uk-yankee.com/index.php?topic=48290.0

but the rest of the world going out of the way to coddle the poor Americans who can't type "visiting the UK" into google is sad and disrespectful to all of us who were able to figure it out. 

I have to take exception to this. In no way have I ever broken any visa laws. I know when to look up rules for visas, etc. But I have never looked at anything beyond tourist sites for a routine visit because, as I put in a comment a few posts up, it never crossed my mind as Im' never that close to actually breaking a rule to worry about the finer points.

But is doing volunteer work or paid babysitting a 'finer point'?  I'm going to the US in June, and even if I wasn't in this industry I'd know to check the rules before I do anything other than sightsee!


Vicky

I have to take exception to this.

You can take exception to this if you so desire.  My response was in that slapping, yellow stickers on Americains foreheads when they enter the UK with the appropriate rules they should follow is one way of addressing the problem and would be useful in assisting others in properly identifying Americans who might not understand the finer points of immigration.

Another is for people to take personal responsability for their actions and understand that if you contrevene the rules, even ignorantly, their maybe ramifications.  My point is do we as society need coffee cups that say "contents may be very hot"?  Personally I have enough going on that I don't need to be told at the UK border what I can and cannot do.  There are sufficient resources out there, for those willing to look, to assist in their understanding of things and I personally feel we don't need to do more then what has already been done.

There have been previous threads about this... From what I have read elsewhere the airline most likely used her return ticket to remove her from the UK. She would have to call the airline and see. But I'm 99% positive that she'll find that she has no unused portion of her ticket.

http://talk.uk-yankee.com/index.php?topic=48290.0 [nofollow]

Ah, OK. Thanks.

I have to take exception to this. In no way have I ever broken any visa laws. I know when to look up rules for visas, etc. But I have never looked at anything beyond tourist sites for a routine visit because, as I put in a comment a few posts up, it never crossed my mind as Im' never that close to actually breaking a rule to worry about the finer points.

I personally think the culture of thinking you can just get on a plane and go to Europe needs to be changed and the message needs to get out there that it is not easy.  I think it is about recognizing that the UK is a different country and the laws and practices may be different from what we know and expect.  It seems very ingrained even just looking at a small sample on this board.  I wish I had the answer to getting that message out to people.

I personally think the culture of thinking you can just get on a plane and go to Europe needs to be changed and the message needs to get out there that it is not easy.

I agree.  I just have no idea how to do it.  I can see how it happens though.  Prior to coming here, I'd only been to Canada and Mexico, no paperwork needed (at that time anyways).  I can definitely see how someone, perhaps being a bit naive and not well-travelled might assume that it's that easy everywhere.  Then you have tabloids reporting about the various famous US/UK couples who have homes in both countries and bounce back and forth between the two. Gwen Stafani/Gavin Rossdale, Gwyneth Paltrow/Chris Martin, Catherine Zeta-Jones and Michael Douglas, and so on.  All people see is the ease at which they move to and fro, no mention of applying for visas and such.  And remember the Ross and Emily storyline in Friends?  They were going to get married in England and Emily was going to relocate to NY immediately after.  The wedding was planned in less than 30 days, and Ross went out immediately before the wedding, no mandatory waiting period for him lol.  I know the finer legal points don't make for good TV, but I remember watching things like that and totally thinking everything was that easy.  Now those types of story lines are ruined for me because all I can think of is that it's unrealistic

I agree.  I just have no idea how to do it. 

Not a problem, this will take care of itself in the next few years. Since the introduction of the passport requirements for all American border crossings, people will pay more attention to what they need to cross in and out of countries. Well reasonable ones anyway. There's no accounting for those who can't be bothered.

I think it comes down to most people not realizing that the entry stamp equals a visa in the UK.  Some travel types will tell you Americans don't need a visa, not realizing that they are referring to applying for a pre-landing visa.  Travelling with a US passport in most countries is incredibly easy compared to the travel many other countries are allowed.  I have travelled with my Palestinian friends.  After watching what they go through, I can see how it would be easy to assume that we aren't required to apply for visas--they have to go through so much more than we do as Americans just to make a quick tourist stop in many countries.

I remember, thought it was quite a long time ago, that US Citizens needed visas for France.

Also, we forget that we are in a VERY VERY VERY serious minority.  Like they say, at any given point there are 250,000 Americans within the M25.  A lot of those are visitors.  If we say, UK wide, there are maybe 500,000 US expatriates in the UK, that is about 0.15% of Americans.  Prior to the passports at border crossings < 10% of Americans had valid passports.

The Office of Statistics says that there are about 4.4 million visits per year from North America.  They don't count unique individuals nor break down the US/Canada/Mexico nor those who might be non-North American citizens.  But still, that is less about 1% of North Americans visit the UK every year.  I supect the vast majority of those take some lame pictures of them standing in front of Big Ben and thereby impeding my progress across the bridge, or they wear their Cowboy hats and speak loudly on the bus taking them to pick up their hire car in Scotland only to realise that it is a manual transmission and jerkingly exit the car park.  Very very few of them are like us where they will be in a situation where they maybe tempted into doing something that complicates their future in the UK.  They come, speak loudly, buy their tat, eat a pork pie and go home.  Then there is the 330+ million that never come here.

Yeah, I suspect Michael Douglas or Madge applying for their ILR doesn't really make the front cover of People, but I remember the curfuffle that Mike Tyson had not too long ago that I think did get note on CNN.com for being a person of bad character and not being allowed in the UK.

While I agree it is frustrating at times, and sad at others that some people get caught up in the finer points, I would think that we want to a) continue to focus on educating those who do find us and b) make sure that UKBA continues to play fairly and consistantly with the rules, which is what is at the heart of the Advocacy here.