The great 087x telephone number rip-off

Just one recent report in the ongoing rip-off and general confusion which surrounds 087x telephone numbers:   

http://www.lep.co.uk/news?articleid=3100349

It's not clear whether this is the newspaper which has got the facts wrong themselves, or whether they were relaying incorrect information from Lancashire County Council.  Either way, it's wrong, and it's clear that the local authority concerned is out to make money.

The report makes it sound as though the cost of calling the county's "Traveline" will go down, doesn't it?

Wrong.  The existing 0870 numbers which have been charged at premium rates (i.e. above normal call costs) are now reverting to normal rates (as called from a BT landline). 

The 0871 number listed that the council is migrating to is in the tariffs at 10 pence per minute at all times -- i.e. far in excess of standard "national" rate. 

http://www.saynoto0870.com/search.php

I use this to find whether there is any alternative.

http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/phones/0870-say-no#step2

and there's some info here on how to call 0870 cheaply if you absolutely have to call one.

From the link:

All this is great news, but its lengthy timescale means, sadly, it won't come into effect until 1 February 2008.  My main worry about the proposal is many companies will just shift from 0870 numbers to 0871 numbers

Precisely what has started to happen, as with Lancashire's Traveline.  The good news is that BT has already revised its tariffs to include 0870 within normal "national" rate.

http://www.productsandservices.bt.com/consumer/consumerProducts/pdf/SpecialisedNos.pdf

When I lived in student flats last year, my landline was an 0870 number...that was pretty annoying. And I always felt vaguely embarrassed when giving out the  number to people, because I knew it was expensive to call..but it was cheaper than my mobile so I gave it to them anyway. And there was no alternative number either, sigh.  Thankfully I don't live there anymore!

Hi,
We use a 0870 number for our business - now you all will say boo hiss!

But,

The reality is the amount we get back from BT isn't really much at all - even percentage wise - in fact the revenue 'kickback' only really generates significant sums for the very large corporates and even then, the perecentage in the midst of things isn't much at all.

We wanted an 0870 number for the positive aspects of it, i.e gives the impression of a larger business, easily accessible from all regions in the country & the fact we get a %back - as every little helps in running a business in the UK as it's so difficult to do so here.

the 'cost' element is down to the phone supplier chosen, BT or a cable provider etc - if THEY are charging more for a 'national' rate call than another provider then thats where the blame lies for 'exorbitant' charges - we business's don't set those rates. The focus has shifted in public perception that it's business profiteering from 0870 numbers, when it's really your TELEPHONE company who are 'profiteering' !

We are now changing to using geographic numbers - it's costing quite a bit to change all our signage, stationary etc - but as a business, no one says 'oh someone should help them!'

Flipside - my mobiles are with O2 - and they provided access to '08' numbers as part of their inclusive minutes - but its now such a shame it's stopped - but they've introduced a charge for calling a 08 number at 20 p /minute - which is much greater than the 2p/min i can call other 01/02 numbers for. I've known about saynoto0870 for a long time, never needed it from the above but until the 'switchover' i'll use it as 'away from my business' i'm also a consumer.

Lastly - although the 0870 furore is a perfectly and valid argument, I like the way it's brought about a 'change' - this now needs to sit with the 'general public' as a whole with everything else 'costs' wise within the UK - maybe THEN the whole country will enjoy better value for money in 'bigger' and argumentatively, more important things than how much it costs to make a national rate call.

Cheers! DtM! West London & Slough UK!

When I lived in student flats last year, my landline was an 0870 number...

Presumably the school (or private building) had a contract with an 0870 provider and it was a condition that you had to use that and couldn't have your own line installed directly?

We use a 0870 number for our business - now you all will say boo hiss!

If you can say that you've had it since the days it when it really did cost the same as a normal call, we might forgive you......   

This is where a lot of confusion and misinformation creeps in.  Originally 0870 was charged exactly the same as a regular national call to a geographic number, just as 0345 and 0645 (which became 0845) were originally charged the same as a local call.   

In fact in the original scheme of things the 0345/0645 numbers were a kind of halfway house between a normal call and 0800 numbers, with the caller paying the same price as a local call and the callee (almost always a large company) picking up the balance of the long-distance tab.

One of the main selling points for a large corporation was the flexible routing these numbers provided.  For example, an organization with offices in London, Bristol, and Edinburgh could publish the same number nationwide, but people calling from the west country or Wales would route to the Bristol office, calls from Scotland would go to Edinburgh, everywhere else to London.   Additionally, calls could be routed to different offices at different times of the day, e.g. if those Bristol and Edinburgh offices kept regular office hours but London was a 24-hour operation, then calls which would normally go to Bristol or Edinburgh could be sent to London after 5 p.m.

It was this initial use of these numbers which, as Dennis says, still suggests to people that they are dealing with a large outfit.

Since then, the cost of long-distance has dropped so much and we now have so many competing carriers that they can make money on not just 0870/0871 but also 0845 numbers. 

The biggest problem, and the issue which really amounts to fraudulent advertising, is the places which are still claiming that 0870/0845 are the same price as a normal national/local call.  Many people just accept this because that's how it used to be.

0870 numbers are supposed to be charged at national rate , however depending on who your home phone provider is it can be higher (as well as calling from a mobile).  Premium rate is anything £1 and over (090, etc.).  However, new legislation has been passed and as of February of next year (2008) any company with 0870 numbers have to switch to 0844 / 0845 as they're cheaper.  This is why you'll see some companies pre-empting and changing their numbers over ahead of time...

0870 numbers are supposed to be charged at national rate

By the way they are still advertised you would think so, but that's not how it turned out.  Carriers started offering "inclusive minutes," which almost always exclude calls to non-geographic numbers, and then the started offering lower rates to regular numbers, leaving 087x as premium-rate in all but name.

The September BT tariff list has already revised 0870 to normal rates, which is a start, but as you say, it's going to be a while before other carriers have to do so as well.

Premium rate is anything £1 and over (090, etc.). 

It depends how you define premium rate, but it certainly doesn't start only above £1 per minute.  If you take it as meaning that the recipient of the call can receive a cut of the call charges, then some 0845 numbers are premium-rate.  BT's list of premium-rate tariffs includes some 09 numbers which are "only" 10 pence per minute, comparable to the charges for some 0871 numbers. 

People have slowly become aware of what's going on with 08 numbers, but many are blissfully unaware that the 070 "personal" numbers are equally bad.  These are also generally excluded from calling plans, and some can be as expensive as some of the 09 premium numbers.