medical treatment for 5-month US visitor with no insurance

We all know that I hate the IHS fee.  But lowering the level of NHS service you can have before a visa refusal actually makes sense.  What surprises me is that the level is still quite high at £500.  £500 is what they are now charging us for 30 months of NHS use (over and above the taxes most of us pay anyway).  I'm surprised that they haven't lowered it to £100.

My mom only got an x-ray and a support-wrap thing to help her make it back to the US so I think it would all be A&E. But that was two years ago, she's been back several times and has no plan to apply for a visa so I think we're okay. But it's very good information to have, hopefully we won't need to use it though.

We all know that I hate the IHS fee.  But lowering the level of NHS service you can have before a visa refusal actually makes sense.  What surprises me is that the level is still quite high at £500.  £500 is what they are now charging us for 30 months of NHS use (over and above the taxes most of us pay anyway).  I'm surprised that they haven't lowered it to £100.

It is going to be so easy to run up a total NHS bill of £500, especially as they now add 50% to the bill if there is no insurance.

From reading other forums -

Just an overnight stay on a ward is £1,000 from what people are posting. i.e. went to A&E and spent a night on a ward and bill was just over 1k as there was no insurance.

A birth seems to be about 3k for a normal birth. Lots of bills for those on forums.

Bills of several thousands running into hundreds of thousands if there are problems with the birth. i.e. the programme on tv where their own government ended up paying their over 100k NHS bill for the birth of their child. That was before the law of 50% can be added to the bill for no insurance,that started from 6 April 2015.

Someone had a bill of 37k as they had a stroke when they visited. That was before the UK brought in the law of adding 50% to the bill if there is no insurance, which they had failed to get.

There was a 98k first bill for cancer treatment on this site.

Then there is the recent consultation to end free A&E for all in England and to bill for ambulances and treatment at the scene by a paramedic etc because 'Brits don't get given that for free in their country'. Also in that consultation, to make the person who sponsored them, resposible for their NHS bill too because at present, the NHS trust has to take the sponsor to court for that.

It won't take much to run up £500 worth of healthcare.

I read that NHS doument in 2015 and it is interesting to see the changes. For me it was the "right to reside" for EU nationals. The EU rule is very simple, you either have a "right to reside" as you are a "qualified person" at all time, or you don't. It's UK immigration law that is complicated. People on here with a spouse visa will learrn UK immigration law, yet there are people who think they are in the UK on EU law, but don't understand that simple "right to reside"

My mom only got an x-ray and a support-wrap thing to help her make it back to the US so I think it would all be A&E. But that was two years ago, she's been back several times and has no plan to apply for a visa so I think we're okay. But it's very good information to have, hopefully we won't need to use it though.

It's not just those who apply for visas to enter or remain. it is for anyone who tries to enter the UK when they have NHS debt. The UK want their bill paid and doesn't want to let them back in in case they are looking to run up more NHS debts.

The NHS trust must now tell the Home Office if someone has an outstanding NHS bills of 1k or over  and haven't paid after 3 months. From April 2016, that was changed to an NHS bill of £500 or over and not paid after 2 months, See the link I gave above on that.


For your mother.
The A&E rules haven't really changed over the years, but not all emergencies and accidents are bill free. Anything that says things like "free for the over 60s" is not free, unless she had a limited leave to remain visa of over 6 months and had paid the £200 a year IHS.

If she had an appointment at A&E that she arrived for, then she pays. If it was something she had before she visited the UK, then she pays.

If she had an accident in the UK and visited A&E, then treatment there would be free if that treatment was received on the A&E ward.

If A&E sent her to x-ray (which is not on A&E) then that is free as A&E sent her straight there.

If she had been booked a bed on a ward and then went for an x-ray, the she pays. Once A&E book onto a bed on a ward, everything is billed, incuding any operations.

Aftercare has to be paid for.

If she used an ambulance, that was free for her. Treatment at the scene by a paramedic, was also free.

No life threatening treatment would be withheld, but it would be billed.

I never leave the UK without insurance, even on a day trip to France. All countries are different, even if the UK has a reciprocal health agrement with them and we often need private insurance too. In Australia, some the UK would pay under the that health agreement with Australia and my private insurers pay the rest (although I always get cover so that my insurers will pay it all).  In the US I needed the same as your mother a few years ago and my private insurers paid  just over $1,000 as neither the UK or US pay and these two countries don't have a reciprocal health agrement .

But lowering the level of NHS service you can have before a visa refusal actually makes sense. 

Does it really? Because what happens is that someone who needs a doctor is scared off by this sort of thing. A lady with abdominal pains...a child with a stubborn chest infection. Perhaps they die because of it...that's not what medicine is about at all. 

The thing is, and sweet lord I get tired of typing this stuff....the amount of money saved, if any is saved at all (which it probably isn't) would not pay for the postage to mail out the Happy Health NHS newsletter.

The NHS is in big trouble...but this isn't anywhere near the cause nor the answer. This Conservative Government is strangling the NHS, freezing funding in an ideological effort to, as a poster above likes to put it, let those who use services pay for them. Privatisation.

And we have elected these people.....

Does it really? Because what happens is that someone who needs a doctor is scared off by this sort of thing. A lady with abdominal pains...a child with a stubborn chest infection. Perhaps they die because of it...that's not what medicine is about at all. 
And we have elected these people.....

Surely the idea is that they take out travel insurance before they arrive (which should be something you do anyway wherever you travel), then use that insurance to pay for/pay off the treatment they get on the NHS - so they shouldn't have a reason to be scared off, since with insurance they shouldn't end up out of pocket. They just need to make sure that they get a bill for the treatment.

And I guess that means more education on NHS treatment eligibility for visitors - both for the NHS staff themselves and for visitors coming to the UK - so that people know if and when they should be paying and what they have to do if they need any medical treatment while in the UK.

Does it really? Because what happens is that someone who needs a doctor is scared off by this sort of thing. A lady with abdominal pains...a child with a stubborn chest infection. Perhaps they die because of it...that's not what medicine is about at all. 

The thing is, and sweet lord I get tired of typing this stuff....the amount of money saved, if any is saved at all (which it probably isn't) would not pay for the postage to mail out the Happy Health NHS newsletter.

The NHS is in big trouble...but this isn't anywhere near the cause nor the answer. This Conservative Government is strangling the NHS, freezing funding in an ideological effort to, as a poster above likes to put it, let those who use services pay for them. Privatisation.

And we have elected these people.....

What I meant was that the lower threshold 'stacks up' to the fees requirement for the IHS.  £1,000 was quite generous when all non-EU migrants are paying £200 a year now.

I personally don't think the NHS needs to treat anyone and everyone for free.  They should treat people requiring services, but they should be allowed to bill too.

This hits close to home for me too.  My parents were here in July and we end up to Scotland for a week.  On day 2, my mom missed the bottom step on a staircase and twisted her ankle.  She was off of it for the rest of the trip, swollen, and bruised.  Even though she had insurance, she did not want to have it checked.  Not sure why but she didn't want to.  She's stubborn!  She finally had it checked 9 days later after they got back to the US and it turns out she had broken her leg! 

People do need to be responsible and have insurance before traveling anywhere.  And they also need to be responsible enough to seek treatment if needed.

the idea is that they take out travel insurance before they arrive

Who can disagree with this? And I think that for the most part the vast majority do. The UK does a thriving business on visitors seeking medical services. 

But pragmatically, creating this system to track it all, administering the system, training and educating a vast number of NHS receptionists....it ends up hurting public health more than helping it.

And it is morally dubious. Turning people away from needed medical treatment, and blocking them from being with their family because of some old medical bill for services that they may have been told were free are not things I see as traits of the humanity I aspire to.

 

I personally don't think the NHS needs to treat anyone and everyone for free.  They should treat people requiring services, but they should be allowed to bill too.

They do bill for it, £116.4 billion for this year....but we all have agreed to chip in together every paycheck and help each other out with that bill.

Surely the idea is that they take out travel insurance before they arrive (which should be something you do anyway wherever you travel), then use that insurance to pay for/pay off the treatment they get on the NHS

Its not only insurance for in the UK, but for the travel to the UK. What happens if the plane is diverted or you get ill on a stopover? I've got British citizen family that retired abroad, but visit the UK insured to the hilt as they know they are not allowed to use the NHS for free, nor use another countries health service for free.

This hits close to home for me too.  My parents were here in July and we end up to Scotland for a week.  On day 2, my mom missed the bottom step on a staircase and twisted her ankle.  She was off of it for the rest of the trip, swollen, and bruised.  Even though she had insurance, she did not want to have it checked.  Not sure why but she didn't want to.  She's stubborn!  She finally had it checked 9 days later after they got back to the US and it turns out she had broken her leg! 

Ouch, bless her.

An elderly neighbour fell over late at night and broke her leg. She waited until 6am to press the button on the cord she wore around her neck, that alerted the call centre, because she didn't want to disturb them late at night! She had all our mobile numbers too and was by her phone, but didn't want to call any of us for the same reason.

Then there are those who the doctors call the time wasters, who run to the GP for every little niggle and then wondered why the GPs asked the government if they could charge for a consultation.

Hmm now I'm wondering about this. I am almost 100% sure that she went to A&E and got an x-ray and an arm band thing, and that's it. They flew home the next day so there was no aftercare. But after all this time how would we find out if she owes money?

Hmm now I'm wondering about this. I am almost 100% sure that she went to A&E and got an x-ray and an arm band thing, and that's it. They flew home the next day so there was no aftercare. But after all this time how would we find out if she owes money?

If you took her to A&E or MIU or UCC and that's all that happened, then that would be no charge.

If you took her to A&E or MIU or UCC and that's all that happened, then that would be no charge.

This is my understanding. But I am a guy on the internet who has read a few things...

If you call the A&E, will they know?

What might happen is that when your mom comes over again and sprains her knee she will be a little more unsure about things and not go in and have it looked at.