Renunciation and Student Loans

I had a question about qualifying for income based repayment after relenquishing/renouncing US citizenship.

I'm currently living in the UK on a spousal visa, applying for ILR in January just before my current spousal visa expires. Depending on cost/time and other life things, I may decide to apply straight away for citizenship since I have been in the UK for three years under the correct visas and am married to a Brit (2 years on a marriage visa, 1 year on a post-study visa) or I may wait until I make the five year mark and apply for citizenship then.

Once I get my citizenship, I plan on relenquishing/renouncing my US citizenship. I understand the cost has gone up from $400+ to $2000+ which I am willing to pay. But also, I have heard that if, upon receiving my British citizenship, I don't act as a citizen by travelling with my US passport or voting in any election, I may be able to relenquish my citizenship. All of this could change within the next few years anyway, but I wanted to make that clear.

I understand my US bank account will be fine even if I get rid of US citizenship, but I am wondering about applying for income based repayment. The past year I have applied for and received income based replayment. My student loans are managed through two companies - Great Lakes and ACS. All of my loans are federal, none are private. In order to qualify for income based replayment, I had to supply them with the previous year's tax return. My concern is that obviously once I am no longer a citizen, I won't have an income tax return to supply for this.

This is an issue because set at the original payment plan my loans were issued at, they came up to about £400 a month, which... is a lot. I am perfectly willing to repay my student loans and I do want to continue doing so, but when I was paying £400, I essentially had zero savings. And actually, I was paying far too much as a self-employed person. I ended up paying them what I should have saved to give to the HMRC and got a pretty hefty tax bill because of it.

Any way, point being, I do want to continue to apply for income based repaying. I know that relenquishing or renouncing my US citizenship is not going to happen anytime soon. I won't get ILR until January 2015 when I apply in person and I don't even know if I will apply for citizenship right away. If I don't, then the earliest I could apply for citizenship would be 2017. And then I'd imagine the process for renouncing/relenquishing my US citizenship will take awhile.

Still, I am around $30k in student debt and don't reckon I will be able to pay that off in 4-5 years, even if I was able to make £400 per month in student loan payments.

So, to sum up: Can you apply for income based repayment on your US student loans if you have renounced/relenquished your US citizenship?

Cheers!
Lola

I will have to say, I don't know the answer to your question. I only just got IBR on my loans this year and will not be relinquishing my citizenship in the foreseeable future.

I will ask you:
Have you asked your student loan companies this question? It seems that they would be the people to ask if there is another document other than a US tax return you can use to verify your earnings.

I don't know the answer to your question, but one thing you have posted is not correct. After you receive UK citizenship, you must continue to use your US passport to enter the US. Not doing so does not mean you relinquish US citizenship. You remain a US citizen until you renounce or it has been taken from you. It has nothing to do with 'not acting as a US citizen'.

Can't speak for Great Lakes/ACS, but when I applied for IBR with Sallie Mae, I didn't actually need tax returns.  I was able to submit 2-3 months of pay stubs, along with an explanatory note 'translating' that into an annual $$ salary.

I put off applying, and spent a year paying £300+/month, because I had the same assumption about tax returns, and I was behind in filing. I really wish I'd known that it didn't matter.

So my advice is to contact the companies, explain your situation, and ask about alternate proofs of income. 

I won't get ILR until January 2015 when I apply in person and I don't even know if I will apply for citizenship right away. If I don't, then the earliest I could apply for citizenship would be 2017.

I'm confused: why couldn't you apply for citizenship until 2017?

Once you have ILR, you can apply for citizenship at any time. If you're still married to a UK citizen, there's no need to wait for the 5-year mark... you just have to meet the following residency criteria on the date you apply:

- you were in the UK exactly 3 years prior to the date you apply for citizenship

- you have not been outside the UK for more than 270 days in those 3 years, with no more than 90 days in the final 12 months.

So, you can apply for citizenship on any date you like after you get ILR in January 2015, as long as you meet those 2 residency criteria (along with the other citizenship requirements).

You can apply right away if you like, or you can apply later in 2015, or during 2016 or any time in 2017... or you can wait 10 years, or 20 years, or even 30 years and apply then. It's completely up to you when you decide to apply.

Once I get my citizenship, I plan on relenquishing/renouncing my US citizenship. I understand the cost has gone up from $400+ to $2000+ which I am willing to pay. But also, I have heard that if, upon receiving my British citizenship, I don't act as a citizen by travelling with my US passport or voting in any election, I may be able to relenquish my citizenship. All of this could change within the next few years anyway, but I wanted to make that clear.

I don't know the answer to your question, but one thing you have posted is not correct. After you receive UK citizenship, you must continue to use your US passport to enter the US. Not doing so does not mean you relinquish US citizenship. You remain a US citizen until you renounce or it has been taken from you. It has nothing to do with 'not acting as a US citizen'.

Geeta, I think you have misunderstood. To clarify this, if between getting UK citizenship and appearing at the embassy to give up US citizenship, you do not perform any actions that only a US citizen can perform (e.g., vote in US elections, travel on a US passport), you are usually allowed to relinquish rather than renounce, as they will accept that you have taken on the new citizenship with the intention of giving up US citizenship. This is technically an expatriating act if you want it to be, but you still have to go through the process of telling the US that you wish to do so. The paperwork is all the same; the only real difference is that, so far, relinquishing is free while renouncing incurs the massive fee. I have a friend going through this process right now, and the consulate is being awkward about letting her relinquish even though she qualifies for it. Once she has a result, I'll post an update about that, but for now, it is definitely worth going with the relinquishment plan to avoid paying the fee.

Does relinquishing mean that you can't visit the US anymore? If you're not meant to use your US passport for any reason when you relinquish, but you have to use your US passport when visiting the US, it would seem as though relinquishing would effectively bar you from visiting. The only way you could then visit the US while not having its citizenship would be to renounce?

Geeta, I think you have misunderstood. To clarify this, if between getting UK citizenship and appearing at the embassy to give up US citizenship, you do not perform any actions that only a US citizen can perform (e.g., vote in US elections, travel on a US passport), you are usually allowed to relinquish rather than renounce, as they will accept that you have taken on the new citizenship with the intention of giving up US citizenship. This is technically an expatriating act if you want it to be, but you still have to go through the process of telling the US that you wish to do so. The paperwork is all the same; the only real difference is that, so far, relinquishing is free while renouncing incurs the massive fee. I have a friend going through this process right now, and the consulate is being awkward about letting her relinquish even though she qualifies for it. Once she has a result, I'll post an update about that, but for now, it is definitely worth going with the relinquishment plan to avoid paying the fee.

I see. So in effect, you are then not traveling to the US at all? Because as a US citizen, you must travel to the US on a US passport.

Does relinquishing mean that you can't visit the US anymore? If you're not meant to use your US passport for any reason when you relinquish, but you have to use your US passport when visiting the US, it would seem as though relinquishing would effectively bar you from visiting. The only way you could then visit the US while not having its citizenship would be to renounce?

No, relinquishing has the same effect as renouncing, that you are no longer a US citizen. They cancel your passport and give you a certificate of loss of nationality, and thereafter the same immigration rules apply to you as to any other foreign national. As a UK citizen, you qualify for the visa waiver, so you would just enter that way.

I see. So in effect, you are then not traveling to the US at all? Because as a US citizen, you must travel to the US on a US passport.

Until you appear at the embassy, you can't travel to the US. The loss of US citizenship is dated from that day.

Thanks for everyone's responses!

I do plan on asking my loan companies, but I applied for IBR via the student loans dot gov site, not through the individual loan providers. I'm applying for IBR again in January, so I'll double check then, but I thought I'd ask in case anyone else had experience.

DrSuperL99, thank you for clearing that up. I don't plan on returning to the US any time soon. In fact, if I wasn't allowed to go back ever, that really wouldn't be an issue for me. I don't have family and I have prolific disabilities that make living in the US a constant struggle for life, so I won't be returning. In fact, becoming a UK citizen and relinquishing my US citizenship is part of making sure that I won't have to go through that anymore (at least, unless the Tories have their way with the NHS).

ksand24, As far as I was sure, you could only apply for citizenship if you have been in the UK under qualifying visas for five years and three years if you are married to a British citizen. I had a post study visa starting in Jan 2012. So I could apply under marriage after I get ILR. But I may actually not be able to afford to get citizenship RIGHT after I get ILR, so I might wait. There's also a chance that my partner and I may live apart. Our lease is coming to an end and I may get a new job that's further north and his is in the South. I'd imagine if we don't live together, I wouldn't be able to apply for citizenship and would then have to wait until Jan 2017.

Have they changed the qualifying period for general citizenship from five years to three?

No, the general period for citizenship if you are NOT married to a UK citizen is 5 years in the UK, plus 12 months of holding ILR (so 6 years in the UK in total), and no more than 450 days outside the UK during those 5 years.

If you are legally married to a UK citizen (whether you currently live together or not - you don't have to provide any evidence of living together for citizenship), you don't have to wait 6 years, you can apply for citizenship as soon as you get ILR as long as you have been in the UK on any visas for 3 years or more and haven't been outside the UK for more than 270 days in those 3 years.

Those are just the minimum times to get citizenship though... you don't have to apply right away - you just apply whenever a) you qualify based on residency and b) you can afford it/it's feasible for you.

Once you have ILR you can apply for citizenship whenever you like, at any time in the future, provided you meet the 3 years and the 270 days requirements on the date you apply.

So, say you spent a significant portion of your 3 years outside the UK, you might not be able to apply for citizenship right away because you would have to wait until you met the 270 days requirement and/or you had proof of being in the UK 3 years prior... Which could be several months, or even a year or two after getting ILR.

Some people wait many years after getting ILR before applying for citizenship, but still apply under the 3-year rule because they are married to a UK citizen. Others apply right away after getting ILR, while some people have to wait an extra year after ILR because they have only been in the UK for 2 years so don't qualify yet.

Wouldn't I have to supply his passport though? Or just our marriage license? I ask because when I did my marriage visa, they took six months to award it to me and he's reluctant to give up his passport again. And so am I, to be honest.

I've been in the UK since September 2010 and have only been outside of the UK (once on a small trip to Germany and another small trip the US) for a total of maybe 13 days. If that. But I've only been in the UK under the "right" visas (first one was a student visa), since Jan 2012.

You can use the Nationality Checking Service, which copies everything and sends it all off for you, so you get to keep your original documents, including passports.

Wouldn't I have to supply his passport though? Or just our marriage license? I ask because when I did my marriage visa, they took six months to award it to me and he's reluctant to give up his passport again. And so am I, to be honest.

You don't have to include his actual passport - you can just send a full photocopy of it (copy must include every page). You didn't have to give up his passport for any other visas either - you could have just sent a copy of it.

And as DrSuperL99 said, you don't have to give up any passports anyway - if you use the Nationality Checking Service (NCS), they copy your passport(s) and give them back before sending your application off.

So, you can include your actual passport, either his actual passport or a photocopy of every page of it, and your marriage certificate... then at the NCS appointment they copy the passport(s) and all your other original documents, give them all back to you and send off the application for you.

I've been in the UK since September 2010 and have only been outside of the UK (once on a small trip to Germany and another small trip the US) for a total of maybe 13 days. If that. But I've only been in the UK under the "right" visas (first one was a student visa), since Jan 2012.

Doesn't matter - time on ANY visa counts, even a visitor visa, as long as you weren't out of the UK for more than 270 days in total during the 3 years (you don't count the date you left the UK or the date you returned, so a trip abroad from Mon to Fri is only 3 days outside the UK).

Citizenship is much, much easier to apply for than any of your other visas. You just show that:
- you are over 18
- you are married to a UK citizen (you need this for ILR anyway)
- you have passed the Life in the UK test (you need this for ILR anyway)
- you are of good character (you pay your taxes if employed and have no unspent criminal convictions (the latter also needed for ILR))
- you were in the UK exactly 3 years prior to the date you apply
- you have not been outside the UK for more than 270 days in those 3 years (no more than 90 days in final 12 months)
- you have 2 referees for the application (both must have known you for 3 years, one must be a suitable professional and the other must be a UK citizen over 25)

As you won't get ILR until 2015 and so won't be able to apply for citizenship until then, they will only count the immediate 3 years prior to the date you apply... from 2012 onwards, so your time in the UK between 2010 and 2012 is completely irrelevant.

- If you apply for citizenship in 2015, they will only count the 3 years from 2012 to 2015.
- If you apply in 2016, they will count 2013 to 2016.
- Apply in 2017, and they will count 2014 to 2017... and so on.