Child Benefits with EU other half

Hi all,

Forgive me for being new to this area of expat life... My partner and I are expecting our first child.

I would like to know if we can apply to the new tax free child care program when it comes out. I'm in the UK on a tier 2 visa and my partner is an EU (Italy) citizen here on free movement of labor rights. My visa states that I'm not eligible for public funds. I recall reading somewhere a while back that if one partner IS eligible for public funds, you can submit the application in their name and get the benefit.

Have I understood this correctly? Can my Italian partner just apply for the tax free childcare scheme, even though the father has no recourse to public funds?  The sticky on benefits is quite antiquated, so I wanted to make a new thread....hope that's ok!

I understand childcare is a huge cost for parents in full time employment, so just trying to be informed on possible help.

Thanks!

Do you mean the childcare vouchers?   They are salary sacrifice, which is totally allowable (for anyone).  And yes, very wise to opt in!

Sorry, no I meant a new scheme which is due in 2017. It seems like a better program than the vouchers, at least for full time care. You can put 10 grand into it instead of the ~245/month for vouchers.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/tax-free-childcare-10-things-parents-should-know

Now I have read it all, it does seem it will be for all working parents.

From your link.
All working families where the parents earn at least £50 per week will have access to government support with childcare costs, unless one of the parents earns over £150,000 or receives support from tax credits, Universal Credit or ESC.


We used to have a lower tax code if we had children (more money in our wages), but then that was stopped and the benefit Tax Credits was created instead, for those parents that don't work or don't work enough hours to support their children. That new benefit sometimes meant that those parents on Tax Credits were often better off than those who earned too much to claim  benefits. Between this and the welfare reforms, it looks like they are switching it back to what it was before.

I assume those earning above the limit for this, will be able to pay more into their pensions to reduce their salary, as they do with avoiding the Self Assessments for those earnng over 100k; and to still get Child Benefit for those earning just over the 50/60k.

Has your Italian husband thought about securing his stay in the UK, in the light of Brexit?

Now I have read it all, it does seem it will be for all working parents.

Thanks, I was afraid they meant all working families that aren't excluded from receiving public funds...

Do you happen to know whether my Italian partner could apply by herself if I were indeed excluded from it?

Has your Italian husband thought about securing his stay in the UK, in the light of Brexit?

No she hasn't, as we've only lived here for a year now and she wouldn't qualify for permanent residence yet. We're just assuming that some deal will be struck where people already here will be allowed to stay. But we're not really planning on being in the UK for more than 3-5 years anyway, so if they kick us out before then, their loss...

Thanks, I was afraid they meant all working families that aren't excluded from receiving public funds...

It doesn't read like that, but the devil will be in the detail at the time.

Do you happen to know whether my Italian partner could apply by herself if I were indeed excluded from it?

Sorry, no idea, they are talking 2017plus and there is too much that will happen before this is countrywide.  Will you or your wife's work give you vouchers?

I'm not sure, but you have to choose vouchers or this new program, and the new program is much better, because you can put up to something like 10k/year into it.

Does anyone know how this is handled with child benefit? If one partner is excluded from public funds and the other is not, can the second partner apply for child benefit solely in their own name?

I'm not sure, but you have to choose vouchers or this new program, and the new program is much better, because you can put up to something like 10k/year into it.

Keep a look out for when this the new programme is starting in your area. I assume the government will keep people updated with when their area is starting this, via their website. This is what they are doing with the Universal Credit roll out. They have been talking about this childcare scheme for years, but it is government, nothing is done quickly.

Does anyone know how this is handled with child benefit? If one partner is excluded from public funds and the other is not, can the second partner apply for child benefit solely in their own name?

While the UK is still in the EU, then your Italian partner will be able to claim UK public funds under EU laws as long as she is a worker qualified person at all times. Those who are a qualified person in the UK as a Self Sufficient, Student or Jobseeker (subject to retained worker rights for a set time) must not claim UK benefits. Those EEA citizens who have no right to reside in the UK as they are not a qualified person under treaty rights, obviously can't have UK benefits either as they have no right to reside in the UK.

This means that as a worker qualified person, your partner can claim Child Benefit but in her name only. You must not put your name on the Child Benefit claim as you are not allowed public funds until you have ILR (after 5 years). Child Benefit is a public fund. Not all UK benefits are public funds.

If either of you earn 50k plus (on your own, not jointly) then this will reduce or your Child Benefit claim and about 60K, will end it. CB is now a income based welfare payment (it didn't used to be). You might be able to bring that salary down if you are only earning just over those amounts, by paying more into your pension. but be careful that doesn't interfere with the amount you must earn for your Tier 2 visa.

One of the things the UK wanted to do under the EU talks prior to 23 June, to try to stop a UK 'Leave' vote, was to stop EEA nationals and their families from having public funds until they had contributed to the UK for 4 years. Your wife will have to see what is offered under Brexit. While there is still EU law in the UK, a worker qualified person can claim UK public funds.

While the UK is still in the EU, then your Italian partner will be able to claim UK public funds under EU laws as long as she is a worker qualified person at all times. Those who are a qualified person in the UK as a Self Sufficient, Student or Jobseeker (subject to retained worker rights for a set time) must not claim UK benefits. Those EEA citizens who have no right to reside in the UK as they are not a qualified person under treaty rights, obviously can't have UK benefits either as they have no right to reside in the UK.

This means that as a worker qualified person, your partner can claim Child Benefit but in her name only. You must not put your name on the Child Benefit claim as you are not allowed public funds until you have ILR (after 5 years). Child Benefit is a public fund. Not all UK benefits are public funds.

If either of you earn 50k plus (on your own, not jointly) then this will reduce or your Child Benefit claim and about 60K, will end it. CB is now a income based welfare payment (it didn't used to be). You might be able to bring that salary down if you are only earning just over those amounts, by paying more into your pension. but be careful that doesn't interfere with the amount you must earn for your Tier 2 visa.

One of the things the UK wanted to do under the EU talks prior to 23 June, to try to stop a UK 'Leave' vote, was to stop EEA nationals and their families from having public funds until they had contributed to the UK for 4 years. Your wife will have to see what is offered under Brexit. While there is still EU law in the UK, a worker qualified person can claim UK public funds.

Thanks a lot for this detailed answer. I have a few follow ups regarding practicalities...

She is a worker qualified person, as she is in full time employment (and will continue to be).

How does it work that she applies "only in her name"? Doesn't it seem on the paper that I don't exist then? How would they know that I earn less than the 50k threshold (which I do), if my name isn't even on the application?

Thanks again!

How does it work that she applies "only in her name"?

The UK has income based and contribution based benefits, with different rules. All the welfare payments are different - well a mess really, hence all the changes and the welfare reforms, to take the income based benefits back to a temporary help and not a lifesytle choice that some claimants have made it.

Child Benefit is not part of the welfare reforms, but it is included as part of the new annual welfare cap (the maximum spend per year for the UK's welfare bill). As said, they decided to change this benefit to make it an income based benefit. At present, this is based on the salary of one parent earing in excess of 50k. Not the best idea as you could have both parents earning 40k each, household income of 80k, and they stlll get full Child Benefit.

Doesn't it seem on the paper that I don't exist then?

You do, but your Italian wife is the only one who can have UK public funds (while the UK has EU laws) and you are not allowed to have your name on a Child Benefit claim as you are in the UK under UK immigration rules (no public funds for 5 years). 

A benefit claimant must state if there any changes that affect their benefits or else they are commiting benefit fraud (have to pay the money back with fine, and in some cases, criminal record, jail, deported).

For Child Benefit, this means that your wife must declare if your salary will be high enough to affect her Child Benefit claim, as CB is now an income based benefit.
For you, if you eaned in excess of the cap allowed for CB and your partner claimed CB, then you would have needed to complete a Self Assessment with HMRC and had your tax code altered. If you didn't do this in time, then you get a fine from HMRC and they will still take your wife's CB money back from you, via your tax code. Looking on other forums at the moment, in some instances, UKVI seems to be taking the 'not filing in a SA with HMRC at the correct time',  as deception - 10 year ban from the UK.

How would they know that I earn less than the 50k threshold (which I do), if my name isn't even on the application?

Data matching. The NHS, UKVI, the various benefits agencies etc, now all data share. For benefit claimants, that catches a lot of people out who "forgot" to tell the benefits agencies of any changes i.e. such as a partner moving in; benefit claimants exiting the UK for a while and not telling the various benefits agencies when they do this, as they are required to do when they go out of the UK.

Plus Child Benefit is claimed from HMRC and you pay your taxes to HMRC, an easy data match for them.

Thanks again!

You're welcome.