UK State Pension - DWP's Questions

I’ve just received my invitation letter to apply for my UK state pension which confirms I am officially old.  I can make the claim online using the unique code provided and by answering some questions.  One of the questions is “dates of time spent living or working abroad”.

Now, I don’t know if DWP know that I have lived and worked abroad - I have.  Do they ask everyone this question, or have they looked at my NI contributions and noticed about 15 missing years in the middle (I have 26 full years contribution in the UK)?  I’ve not made any voluntary contributions so they wouldn’t know that way.  They don’t WEP a UK state pension in the same way that the US does so why would they be interested (other than using years working abroad to meet the UK qualifying years requirement - which isn’t needed in my case, and they would know that).

Anybody in a similar situation been through this process?  And if so, any idea what’s their rationale for asking the question?  Just curious, nothing more.  I’m always curious when an organisation, especially government, asks a question and I don’t know why they’re asking it.

My wife and I have both been through this online application process in the last couple of years. We both simply gave the dates we were out of the country, and received exactly the amount of pension we expected for the number of year’s contributions that we had. No point in lying about something like this just because you don’t know why they want to know. There may well be Totalization agreements or WEP style agreements with various countries, I don’t know. I only know about the WEP and Totalization associated with the USA and UK.

My wife and I have both been through this online application process in the last couple of years. We both simply gave the dates we were out of the country, and received exactly the amount of pension we expected for the number of year’s contributions that we had. No point in lying about something like this just because you don’t know why they want to know. There may well be Totalization agreements or WEP style agreements with various countries, I don’t know. I only know about the WEP and Totalization associated with the USA and UK.

Thanks @durhamlad.  I wouldn't dare lie, BTW, that would be naughty.

I'll give you an anomalous  situation though.  When I first worked in the US, it was on secondment as a sort of "intra company" transfer from the UK - technically we transferred to the US arm of the company for the duration.  This was all above board and there were a whole bunch of us.  However, we continued to pay NI in the UK for those years, and not as voluntary contributions - it was taken from PAYE.  We didn't pay US SS (according to my records) although we did pay US tax.  So, whereas we were "living and working abroad", to all intents and purposes we may as well have been in the UK as far as NI was concerned.  I'll tell DWP that for those years we "lived and worked abroad" but we continued paying NI as if we were still in the UK.

Thanks @durhamlad.  I wouldn't dare lie, BTW, that would be naughty.

I'll give you an anomalous  situation though.  When I first worked in the US, it was on secondment as a sort of "intra company" transfer from the UK - technically we transferred to the US arm of the company for the duration.  This was all above board and there were a whole bunch of us.  However, we continued to pay NI in the UK for those years, and not as voluntary contributions - it was taken from PAYE.  We didn't pay US SS (according to my records) although we did pay US tax.  So, whereas we were "living and working abroad", to all intents and purposes we may as well have been in the UK as far as NI was concerned.  I'll tell DWP that for those years we "lived and worked abroad" but we continued paying NI as if we were still in the UK.

Sounds similar to my situation. For the first 6 years in the USA part of my pay was paid out of the UK keeping up with both my UK company  pension and also NI contributions. Then I made a permanent transfer to the US subsidiary.

Sounds similar to my situation. For the first 6 years in the USA part of my pay was paid out of the UK keeping up with both my UK company  pension and also NI contributions. Then I made a permanent transfer to the US subsidiary.

Very similar.  So for those 6 years, I take it you told DWP that you were living/working abroad?

Very similar.  So for those 6 years, I take it you told DWP that you were living/working abroad?

I certainly did. My NI record shows those 6 years as full years from pay. I then have a long gap in my record until I started paying voluntary contributions because I wasn’t smart enough to continue to pay after I transferred to the USA company. I ended up with 30 years contributions.

I certainly did. My NI record shows those 6 years as full years from pay. I then have a long gap in my record until I started paying voluntary contributions because I wasn’t smart enough to continue to pay after I transferred to the USA company. I ended up with 30 years contributions.

Thanks.  I made no voluntary contributions while abroad but I just made a one year contribution today - I had a part year that only required a small topup so it was a no-brainer.  I think I shall wait for that to register before claiming my UK state pension.

Now, I don’t know if DWP know that I have lived and worked abroad - I have.  Do they ask everyone this question, or have they looked at my NI contributions and noticed about 15 missing years in the middle (I have 26 full years contribution in the UK)? 

I have no idea why they ask the question, but as all the tax payment records are held with HMRC; and the DWP have access to those; they can see all the years you didn't pay taxes to the UK.

For obvious reasons, the DWP works closely with the HMRC records and HMRC's RTI (Real Time Information) system.

You should check your income tax and national insurance records often, to make sure  the information held with HMRC is correct, to save problems later if either a public sector worker made a mistake or somebody else is using your NI number (which could be a genuine error or being used by an illegal worker). Check your tax code is correct too.

You should check Company House records too, to ensure somebody hasn't registered your property as the address for their company. Company House don't check the address given.

I certainly did. My NI record shows those 6 years as full years from pay. I then have a long gap in my record until I started paying voluntary contributions because I wasn’t smart enough to continue to pay after I transferred to the USA company. I ended up with 30 years contributions.

I've tried to explain to a relative who has just moved to the US, that they should continue to pay NI: the very cheap Type 2 Contributions

Can't you pay for the missing years? Although some can't make the 35 years of New state pension that started April 2016, because of their age.

Thanks.  I made no voluntary contributions while abroad but I just made a one year contribution today - I had a part year that only required a small topup so it was a no-brainer.  I think I shall wait for that to register before claiming my UK state pension.

Did the DWP confirm that is was a year that would increase your state pension?

I've tried to explain to a relative who has just moved to the US, that they should continue to pay NI: the very cheap Type 2 Contributions

Can't you pay for the missing years? Although some can't make the 35 years of New state pension that started April 2016, because of their age.

We paid for as many missing years as we could and were all set to make the 30 years we needed. Although born in the same calendar  year my birthday is in February and my wife in November so she was born in a different tax year to me which meant she managed 31 years. When the increased age was announced they allowed those born 1954 and before to make up an additional few years to hit 35 years.  I was 6 weeks too young, my wife 11 months too young.  It is what it is, we are very fortunate not to need the missing income so just a minor issue for us.

I definitely screwed up in my 30’s when I had the chance to pay Class 2 contributions.

When the increased age was announced they allowed those born 1954 and before to make up an additional few years to hit 35 years.  I was 6 weeks too young, my wife 11 months too young.  It is what it is, we are very fortunate not to need the missing income so just a minor issue for us.

They couldn't make their pensions to 35 years. Under the New State Pension, they could only carry 30 Qualifying years over from April 2016 and lost all their other QYs before April 2016 (when the new state pension started).

It was then impossible to get another 5 QYs from April 2016 before their reached state pension age of 65 and a half. And they were not allowed to count the tax year they reached SP age, even if they worked and paid Type 1 NICs that year and had a full qualifying year according to HMRC records, because the DWP Pension Services are not allowed to count that year towards the state pension as statute says they can't.

I definitely screwed up in my 30’s when I had the chance to pay Class 2 contributions.

Can't you backdate them before the deadline? Assuming those years will count as a QY for a state pension, otherwise it would be a waste of money.

They couldn't make their pensions to 35 years. Under the New State Pension, they could only carry 30 Qualifying years over from April 2016 and lost all their other QYs before April 2016 (when the new state pension started).

It was then impossible to get another 5 QYs from April 2016 before their reached state pension age of 65 and a half. And they were not allowed to count the tax year they reached SP age, even if they worked and paid Type 1 NICs that year and had a full qualifying year according to HMRC records, because the DWP Pension Services are not allowed to count that year towards the state pension as statute says they can't.

Can't you backdate them before the deadline? Assuming those years will count as a QY for a state pension, otherwise it would be a waste of money.

They only let me backdate the current year and the previous 6.  (I applied in January about 2010 or 11 so was pleased to get 7 years )

https://www.gov.uk/voluntary-national-insurance-contributions/deadlines

Did the DWP confirm that is was a year that would increase your state pension?

Yes they did.  £140 ish gets me an extra £5.82 a week.  No brainer.

They only let me backdate the current year and the previous 6.  (I applied in January about 2010 or 11 so was pleased to get 7 years )

https://www.gov.uk/voluntary-national-insurance-contributions/deadlines

Does the extension help you or your wife, to gain an extra year or two? For years counting towards a state pension I mean, not just paying for gaps that won't count towards the New state pension.

Anyone with gaps in their National Insurance record from April 2006 onwards now has more time to decide whether to fill the gaps to boost their new State Pension. Any payments made will be at the lower 2022 to 2023 tax year rates.
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/taxpayers-given-more-time-for-voluntary-national-insurance-contributions