Breast is Best

I am really puzzled about the whole breast thing. Breast milk is best nobody can deny that but why cant the mothers pump it and put it in a cup or bottle for their older kids? Also I was a bit freaked that the Spanish woman really wanted the little Chinese girl to suckle and ended up giving her a breast shaped bottle. Why not just give her a regular bottle with breastmilk in it?

I've worked with several adoptive moms to establish a milk supply prior to adoption. Some never do get to the point that they have enough milk for a baby, but many can, especially using a special supplemental feeding tube which attaches to their nipple. The psychological benefits last far beyond the nutritional needs...it can be so comforting and helps with the bonding process. I think that is why she wanted her to latch on so badly, and she might have been successful once the cameras stopped filming and they got home where there was some privacy.

I've worked with several adoptive moms to establish a milk supply prior to adoption. Some never do get to the point that they have enough milk for a baby, but many can, especially using a special supplemental feeding tube which attaches to their nipple. The psychological benefits last far beyond the nutritional needs...it can be so comforting and helps with the bonding process. I think that is why she wanted her to latch on so badly, and she might have been successful once the cameras stopped filming and they got home where there was some privacy.

I was adopted and never breastfed and I think that I bonded with both of my parents very well. I know that breastfeeding is special and nutritionally important right after birth, but I guess I just see trying to bond with an adopted child using breastfeeding as a bit forced, really.

Yeah that really grossed me out! I kept thinking what this guys work colleagues were going to say to him when he went to work today! Also what if some of those older girls schoolmates were watching! How horrible it would be for them to have to go to school and face that!!

We said the same thing. That guy will have the piss taken out of him for ages!

I also said to Dale last night that the 7yr old will probably grow up messed up in the head little. To be that dependant on breastmilk at that age is just weeeeeeeeeird

I was adopted and never breastfed and I think that I bonded with both of my parents very well.

I agree.  A lot of people seem to forget that babyhood/toddlerhood is such a SMALL part of a person's life.  This whole 'bonding' thing escapes me - the idea that a parent has to do certain things to 'establish a bond'.  Sounds psychobabblish to me.  I mean, they're your children, how much more of a 'bond' do you need? 

Of course, I love my children to bits, but there are so many ways in which we are connected.  Men, afterall, don't breastfeed their kids, yet they 'bond' w/them anyhow. 

Yeah, the 7 and 10 year old girls . . . that was just whacked.

First, lack of bonding and abandonment issues in toddlerhood and infancy can have a substantial impact on adult psychological well being if not addressed early on.  The need for bonding is well established in both the pyschological and medical fields. 

I can't think of a single parent on here that does not try to see to the physical and mental well being of their infant or toddler.

Secondly, many children that are being adopted in these early years are coming from group homes and often suffering from substandard care or minimal care at best.  Therefore someones attempt at bonding in whatever way they can is a good thing.  Many adoptive parents have to avail themselves of psychological help to create a bond and trust between them and the child.  A lot depends on how long they have been in care and what type of care they received.

One thing is to try to simulate the breast feeding bond with an infant you have adopted and whole other to breast feed a 10 year old.

I think there is room in the world for most people and cannot see the harm in an adoptive mother trying to use breast feeding as a bond.

First, lack of bonding and abandonment issues in toddlerhood and infancy can have a substantial impact on adult psychological well being if not addressed early on.  The need for bonding is well established in both the pyschological and medical fields. 

Well of course it is.  But everyone's definition of it is different.  Believe you me, it's possible for people who bottlefeed their children to bond w/them, just as it's possible for men to bond w/their children even though they don't breastfeed them.  Ditto adoptive parents and parents who may have had to be separated from their children temporarily.

 

I can't think of a single parent on here that does not try to see to the physical and mental well being of their infant or toddler.

Yes, and? 

Did I say anything about bottle feeding being bad?

and.... nothing...

obviously my opinions and questions are not welcomed here.

on second thought...and after my non-logical huff...

Basically I was trying to say that most normal people do have a bond with their infants and toddlers, and that it is a very important time of life.  So since people are concerned with the well being of their infants and toddlers apart from just meeting their basic needs, it stand to reason that   many of them do indeed feel that it is not such a small part of a person's life. I also do not like the use of the term psychobabble to describe sound pyschological arguements.  That however, is a personal thing.

obviously my opinions and questions are not welcomed here.

Huh? 

Nevermind.  Off to see to my sleeping infant's well-being and waken napping toddler/princess-the-destroyer. 

I wasn't quite sure how to take the show. On the one hand, it was actually not as voyeuristic as I thought it would be but on the other, it was still a bit much for me. I'm due in April and have been struggling with the whole breast feeding thing. I haven't particularly enjoyed being pregnant and really dislike the pushiness I have encountered with some of the pro-breast brigade. TBH, it's probably made me think less of it than I would have if I'd been left to my own devices.

What I found more interesting than the whole age thing, though, is the acceptability of it in public. I live in a very small town. Most of the shops/restaurants/etc can barely fit in a decent loo, let alone a mother and baby room. I have already heard stories of breast feeding mothers being told to stop by police and security guards here. And if that happened to me, after all the effort of trying to get out of the house with a baby, I would probably go ape sh*t!!  I was frankly amazed how some of those people seemed so adamantly against seeing it in public (though obviously it was edited to show just that).

Just out of curiousity, does anyone know how the UK compares to the US in terms of breastfeeding?

First off....

I didn't mean to imply that adoptive parents and children do not have a bond! And I do have to point out a flaw in expat's comments about bonding...just because they are your biological children does not mean you naturally have a bond. It is a choice, even if you are not aware of making it.

VNP was right...bonding is very important for psychological and physical wellbeing...the studies are well-known and I don't need to get into that. And, I don't think she was saying that bottle-feeding moms and/or dads can't bond with their children. Bonding, feelings of well-being and "belonging" can be nurtured by skin to skin contact, warmth, nourishment, eye contact etc...all things breastfeeding provides. You cannot put a baby in his/her stroller and prop up a bottle...the mother and infant are in close physical contact. Hormones make it a pleasant experience for the mother. It is a mutually satisfying relationship. Newborn's eyes focus at about 10-12 inches, which means that when he/she is breastfeeding they can see their mother's face clearly. Did you know there are studies that show that newborns can smell which mom is their own?

But, I am not really talking about breastfeeding your own baby...I was trying to say that breastfeeding is beneficial for an adoptive baby because it gives lots of skin on skin contact, associated with nourishment and contentment, and that helps the parent feel like this child is really theirs and help the child feel like they belong to the adult. I am NOT saying this does not happen with bottle-fed children at all....I am just saying that breastfeeding is a wonderful way to establish a relationship with an adoptive child.

I didn't mean to imply that adoptive parents and children do not have a bond! And I do have to point out a flaw in expat's comments about bonding...just because they are your biological children does not mean you naturally have a bond. It is a choice, even if you are not aware of making it.

I just think a lot of folks go OTT w/the whole 'bonding' issue, so that if you don't do XYZ right away, it's not there and won't be.  That's a load of tosh and I think can lead to a lot of needless guilt for new mums.  I had BAD PND w/Aillidh.  Horrid.  We had lots of 'skin to skin' and I breastfed her for a fortnight and carried her round in a sling for the first few months.  But the 'bond' didn't come till later.  She's in no way damaged for life. 

I have a very 'it takes a village' approach to bringing up kids, maybe b/c I grew up in a situation with lots of caregivers around, not just my mother - both parents had big families and lived in close proximity to one another, so there were always cousins, aunts, uncles, friends, etc around.  Infants can establish strong links w/many caregivers, not just their mothers.

I'm not saying skin to skin and breastfeeding are bad, I did it myself w/both girls.  Just that I feel a lot of Western culture puts huge amounts of pressure on mothers to 'bond' and be one w/their children 24/7.  I find it unhealthy is some respects, personally.

Just my 2p.

Well expat I do think there is some truth to that... whether due to PND or just other reasons there are plenty of moms out there that  just don't feel that instant bolt of lightening connection one is allegedly suppose to feel.

Truth is not many people are willing to admit it either, which then does set up the whole guilt cycle.  I do think however that hopefully the child does not realize that disconnect so long as you are doing what you need to do. 

My dear friend is a pyschologist and she even admited to me that it took her a while.  She said for the first fews days her husband was the primary caretaker aside from the breast feeding.  She just sat in some type of post partum coma... it did eventually happen though.

Also growing up in a latin family you often get so much bonding it's crazy..

I wasn't quite sure how to take the show. On the one hand, it was actually not as voyeuristic as I thought it would be but on the other, it was still a bit much for me. I'm due in April and have been struggling with the whole breast feeding thing. I haven't particularly enjoyed being pregnant and really dislike the pushiness I have encountered with some of the pro-breast brigade. TBH, it's probably made me think less of it than I would have if I'd been left to my own devices.

My breastfeeding advice (not that you asked) is try it.  Just try it.  Give it two weeks.  If after two weeks you hate it and don't want to do it, don't, and don't feel guilty about it.  Or say, "I'll give it one more week" and after that week you might like it.  When Morgan was born I thought I would give it three weeks.  We're still bfing (at night only) at 13 months.  You might really enjoy it, or think it's much easier (I got so much more sleep with Morgan than Dagmar, because of the bfing I could just sleep with her.  Whole 'nother discussion.)  You might not.  But if you try it, you'll never wonder later if you should have.


And I don't think anyone needs to bf in public.  I don't care how natural it is-I don't want to see anybody's chests while I'm eating, male or female, adult or child, whatever.  Pump beforehand or go home before feeding time or whatever-I got this far without ever once having to latch her on in public (and only once did I have to sit in the car because we got caught out.) 
Not trying to stir up a storm, just my opinion.

I understand what you're saying about the whole "this is THE way to bond" issue and causing guilt...I am in no way saying that you have to do XYorZ or else you will not bond! There are so many "ways" and I am not even saying that there is any sort of measurement that shows that NOW you are bonded! My definition of bonding does not include 24/7 contact either. Feeling love from any source is important to children...and adults! Children are such sensual beings...skin to skin (like bathing...with mom or dad) is so important. Being held close...by grammies, grampies, siblings, aunts, adoptive parents, step-parents and so on...and being paid attention to...is what I am talking about. I am just saying that breastfeeding encourages this "bonding" because for the baby it is being held in familiar arms where he/she can hear the same heart beating that they heard from conception and smell their own unique mommy smell and the physically painful pangs of hunger go away as their belly is filled with sweet-tasting nourishment....and as the mother breastfeeds the pressure in her breasts are relieved and hormones are released that promote a feeling of well-being and peace and she feels a sense of accomplishment etc. etc....so it creates and sustains quite a strong "bond."

Dont want to get involved in any debate but I just wanted to add that all my sons were bottlefed since birth. I tried breastfeeding with Jack for two days but that was it. We are all very close and they are all very healthy, happy and well-adjusted boys.