two problems

Hi guys, any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

We live in a 'new' (1970s) flat that has a problem with condensation and ventilation. In the past we even had mold growing on the walls. We have that under control now (dehumidifier) but I have 2 small problems.

The first is the front loading washing machine. We've only had it since October and already I've had  a bit of mold growing in the soap dispenser drawer and a bit in the rubber sealing in the door. I keep them open whenever possible but it's a tiny kitchen so we bump into things if we have them open all the time. Any ideas?

The other problem is we don't seem to have a good place to keep our potatoes! Isn't the best thing dark, cool and dry (and not in plastic?). I think every cupboard and cabinet in this flat is a bit humid. I'm so tired of them sprouting after only a week! Should I just keep them in the fridge? 

Try keeping them out in a bowl on the table or counter.  You don't want to put them in the fridge, the starch will convert to suagr and they'll be useless after like 2 days.
Dark, in my opinion, isn't as important as dry (at least relatively dry).

Unfortunately, damp/mold/wet, etc. is a problem in this country. There's a price we pay for lush green.

Your dampness needs to be fixed.

We've discussed damp in all sorts of threads, so I'm trying to recall what's been said. Also check out "House and Garden" in case I haven't remembered stuff.

When we got our house, we noticed just how wet it had been for a number of years. Seeing as it's 200 years old, we did see evidence that could have been at least 50 years old. You see, folks back then knew how to build houses...and people since have tended to forget some of the basics and tend to muck up a good thing with their own DIY.

The first thing we did was to open it up and clear out things. We have sash windows, so creating an airflow through them is no problem. We also opened up all the fireplaces. Because your home is a 1970s model, I doubt it has fireplaces, and it probably has double-glazing. And air-tight home may be warmer in winter, but it might also rot from the inside out.

Thankfully, we're heading toward summer when doors and windows can be open. I'd suggest you do this as much as possible.

Also, check your gutters. If they are blocked with anything (dirt, leaves...) clear them. You don't want water build-up anywhere outside your house, so look for tell-tale signs of water settling in some place and then see if you can fix that.

Check for cracks in the walls, or brick work that might need repointing. We ended up having to tank a room that was just not going to be fixed any other way. (Tanking is painting a rubber-like membrane on all the walls...moisture is not getting in, but it is probably still hanging out in the outside walls.) This was our tny utility room and cost about £2000. Not a great option and almost a last-ditch resolution.

We also had some damp coursing done. A lesser cost. That's basically trying to manage rising damp, wet that's coming from the ground.

Your house is new enough to have had some damp coursing already, but sadly, I think homebuilders (in the '70s especially) tended to cut corners and just plop down houses. So it may have been put on a piece of ground that's just plain wet, no matter what.

Your problem may not be as easy to fix as ours was. A dehumidifier is only a bandaid relief until you can discover just what is causing the damp.

You should NOT be having these damp problems as bad as it sounds. Just because this tends to be a wet country, that doesn't mean you have to live in wet. Check out areas that can be easily fixed, like clearing out things that can retain wet. Look at the outside wall where it hits worst in your kitchen. Is there a raised flower bed there? If you don't have a source of airflow through your house (like a fireplace or a vented window) consider instlling something that will create an air flow. Clean your gutters!

If you don't see an easy solution, you may have a bigger problem than you want. Damp-proofing people can come by and give you a free quote. Have them try to find the problem. If their news isn't good, consider your options, including moving.

You should not live with damp...especially considering that it is preventable (easy in most cases), and for the damage it does. If your new washer is moldy, what's it doing to your 30-year-old electrical wiring? If your ptoatoes go moldy too quickly, what other food have you been eating that's been affected?

These two problems are indicators you have a bigger problem that hasn't been sorted yet. It could be a very very simple solution.

(We've actually dealt with our damp from many different angles, and still have one to yet fix...because it's a listed builidng, we have to approach this one gingerly with the conservation people. But, I am happy to report that one of the things we did do helped with about 75% of the problem. Cleaning the downpipes and gutters seems so simple, and yet there was so much muck built up that we didn't know whether to laugh or cry at the previous owner's ignorance. Folks before us just kept putting up new ceilings and stuffing toilet paper in cracks. An entire original herribone wooden floor was completely damaged because water was coming in and forming a pool on the floor. Well, d'uh! The house had been so wet for so long that now all our orignial wooden doors are cracking because they are finally dry.)

I know. I didn't really answer your question above. It's just that you still have a much bigger problem, bigger than what a dehumidifer can fix.

The washer, well, no, it shouldn't have mold. You're probably getting mold in all your clothes, too. Our washer is six years old. No mold.

As for the potatoes, we keep potatoes and onions in a separate bin (something Graham made) that has two basket drawers. No, not the woven-type baskets...the coated metal ones. This creates a really good airflow around them. For a quick fix, how about getting a small rubbish bin, like the "office" kind, which is mesh?

Hi LisaE, thanks for all the above. I guess I should have made things a bit clearer though... we rent and have been through a lot of this with the managing estate agent already. In addition to the dehumidifier (which they provided) we bought a nice used tumble dryer. And, you are right, since it was winter, we weren't opening the windows enough. We finally had an extractor fan installed in the kitchen though as far as I can see, it's utterly useless. So with all that, the really bad mold from condensation is mostly taken care of and we're biding our time until we can move again.

The remaining big problem now seems to be storage areas - some of the kitchen cupboards, the airing cupboard, a closet in the living room, the washer. None of these get enough air flow or warmth. We've put the damp crystals from Lakeland in the kitchen cupboards so my spices, sugar and flour won't harden (and I import lots of ziplock!) but it's still just not quite enough. Right now the onions and potatoes (after trying some other places) are in some stacking plastic bins that are supposed to be specifically for veg but the kitchen is small so all I have to do is boil a pan of water and the whole room is humid. We open the windows if the weather is good but can't leave them open all the time (we have cats who we don't let out). We're in the process of buying screens for some of the windows so we can leave them open all the time when it's nice out, but, lets be honest, this is England! And on top of all that, we took down some of the doors in the flat to increase airflow (why a 1970s flat needed doors on the kitchen and living room is beyond me).

Anyway, I'm afraid some of these woes we will just have to put up with until we can move again. As I've said in some other threads, rental properties are few and far between in this area and we are hesitant to move before the wedding, but we are keeping our eyes open. I was just hoping I might get some ideas because the potatoes and washer are driving me nuts!

*Sigh*

(why a 1970s flat needed doors on the kitchen and living room is beyond me)

Because there's this nice little building reg that says you must have at least two doors between your kitchen and bathroom.  We used to live in a studio flat in which the living room and kitchen were open-plan.  To get to the bathroom, there was door, then a two-foot walkway, then the door to the bathroom.

I don't know if this is relevant or not and may in fact gross a few people out but.....you really need to watch where you store potatos, because mice love them and there's a serious risk of menengitis from exposure to their urine which they have a tendency to pee on as well as nibble. Some years back here in Boston when the local transit authority was extending the underground train lines through congested neighborhoods and doing a lot of digging, they caused a huge problem with infestation. Within months there was a breakout of menengitis in the affected neighborhoods along the new train route. The local, state and federal health authorities were forced to investigate and after some months discovered the problem was stemming from homes that were storing potatos in cupboards and pantrys that were infested by mice. The transit authority was then forced to pay millions in law suits because they failed to recognize the potential problem and warn people in the affectd areas prior to digging..............strange but true.

"you must have at least two doors between your kitchen and bathroom"

Why?

Well, as for the mice, fortunately that's one problem we don't have and I'm sure the cats will keep it that way!

Graham's son and his wife are renting and going through the same sort of talks with their landlord. For them it's a roof that's going to collapse if they can't stop the leak. House smells of mildew and they've been keeping their heat on to try to solve the problem. It's a nightmare for renters, just because hands are so tied!

The door thing...fire hazards/fire containment. You also might find that doors can contain some of the condensation within that room so it doesn't spread.

Do you have more than one floor? If you have a top floor that's not easily reached by intruders, perhaps cracking a window might help. You say an extractor fan was installed, do you know if it vents to the outside? Some "extractor fans" just circulate the air inside.

Sorry...the potatoes and the mold in the washer are just your canaries. They signal a bigger problem that hasn't been dealt with and I don't see there's a lot that can be done about either one unless the problem is sorted.

Understand they are driving you nuts. And I wish I could help...and I wish that what I say would make everything magically go away for you. Truth is, the problem isn't sorted with a vent and a dehumidifier. Find the source. It's there and it's obvious once you locate it. That will fix your potato and your mold problems.

Just a few tips from my DIY site on Mildew/mould.

As for potatoes, well putting them in the dark does encourge them to sprout, but storing them in dry sand in say a wooden box or bin would prevent this, thats how potatoes used to be stored in the long passed victorian times, and it still works.

You may first notice mildew by its musty odor. It leaves an ugly black stain which can rot fabric, leather and paper. And it can cause problems for those with allergies. Mold and mildew are often found in basements, closets, showers and under beds. They will grow wherever it is damp and warm, and there is little air movement.

Mold and mildew are hard to remove, but not hard to prevent. Since they are tiny plants, you must make it hard for them to grow. To keep your home free from mold and mildew:


Keep things and places clean.

Even small amounts of dirt or dried food will help mildew grow. Keeping closets, drawers, walls and clothing clean will prevent many mildew problems.

Keep things dry.

At the first sign of mildew, find the source of moisture. Is it from a leak in the basement or roof or a spill? To keep your home dry:

Wipe down shower walls after taking a shower.

Cover pots while cooking.

Vent the clothes dryer to the outside of the house.

Use exhaust fans in the kitchen, utility room and bathroom.
 
Be sure you have air movement in all areas.

Open windows to let outside air in, if the weather is nice.

Use a fan, even in the winter, to move the air.

Don't put furniture tightly against the wall.

Dry the air.

Heat the air in closets by keeping a light bulb burning, if there is one in the closet.

Use a heater, or turn on the furnace if the house is damp.

Use a dehumidifier.

Use chemicals such as Silica gel to absorb moisture. Place on a closet shelf or hang in a cloth bag to absorb moisture. Keep out of the reach of children.
Keep fabrics clean and dry.


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Thanks for all the tips and hints folks. We've had builders here twice to see why we had the big mold problem. It's not rising damp, there are no obvious leaks, we leave one window open almost all the time, the new extractor vents to the outside but, as I said, we still have to open the window if we're boiling anything, we don't dry clothes except outside or in the dryer, there's no extractor in the bathroom and they won't put one in ("just open the window"). Yep, basically, our hands are tied. Now I'm starting to worry about the clothes we have stored over the winter. Argh.

re: potatoes... throw an apple into the bag of potatoes and they'll not root.