Cars: Do We Need Them? (was: Inconvenient Annoyances)

Denis,
Have you read very much about cars that run on compressed air?

there was a time in the UK that very few people had cars and those without cars were able to make it. I know it was different then. The public transportation has been pretty much destroyed.

That's the problem.  The little branch-line railways which once stretched into quite remote, rural areas were decimated after the Beeching report, although some had already started to close before then.  Bus services have deteriorated drastically in more recent times too, as operators drop unprofitable routes. 

The train and bus services which are left in many places are either too unreliable, don't run at the right times for many people, or are simply way too expensive even compared to the high costs of running a car due to the extortionate taxation -- Usually a combination of all three. 

Come out to the sticks, and a car is simply the only practical method of transport for most people these days.

So I'm wondering what the solution is? One is the congestion tax which will allow the select few to operate. Another is subsidizing the PT.

Darn, some of you people can't see my writing was partly in jest but I would like to point out since you choose to take me seriously that there was a time in the UK that very few people had cars and those without cars were able to make it.

Before people had cars they rode horses and the roads were full of sh*t. Literally.And sh*t lying all over the place leads to the spread of disesase.

The old days weren't as great as some people think.

I wish we could have done without our car in the UK. In ruraly Cumbria, our car was pretty much the only option. There was one bus that came by once a week only. I could get to the stop, but MIL has arthritis and the walk would wear her out before she even got to town.

Even living in the city centre (Exeter) was hard. There was no decent nursery within walking distance or bus route to us (unless we changed 3x). There was, for many months, not even a corner shop.

Here in the US, I'm effectively car sharing. Which is nuts. I'm being better about car use here than I ever was in the UK!

I'd like to have a car, but honestly I know I don't really need one- it would be for convenience only.  But then I live near the centre of a major city- if I lived where my in-laws do in rural Leicestershire a car would be pretty much a necessity.

I do think that as my career progresses I will make it a priority to live as close to work as possible- with the economy the way it is now and me being low down on the totem pole in terms of seniority I can't afford not to consider roles that would require a longer commute.  But in 5 years or so, I hope to commute as little as possible.

hi

it's quite simple:

if you live in London: you don't need a car. It's too expensive and too slow. Besides, it takes about 2 hours just to get out of the city, or four on Friday afternoon.

if you live outside London, especially in smaller cities: you will need a car, the public transport is unreliable and expensive.

Here is a novel option...  Where I live (Wash DC) there are things called "slug spots".  During rush hour, you require 2/3 people in the car to go in the HOV lane.  So single drivers stop at designated "slug lines" and pick up people they don't know so they have enough occupancy.  They then drop them off at the designated drop off spot.  Each slug line corresponds with a different drop off zone.  The "slug" typically sits in the back and leaves the driver alone to listen to their music, talk on the phone, etc.  I wouldn't think it is the safest thing on Earth but the commute time difference between the HOV lane and the regular lanes is quite significant. 

They have been doing that for about 20 years in the San Fransico Bay Area. People pull into the train (BART) parking lot and pick up 2 passengers and they get a free ride into the city instead of having to stand up on the train. The driver gets to use the HOV lane and also doesn't have to pay the toll on the bridge. Win, Win.

In the States, I always had a car. Living in a sprawling metropolis made it a nightmare to try to use public transport (though Phoenix has built the Light Rail, which is a great step towards more efficient public transportation there!)

I also lived in Denver, Colorado. In comparison to Phoenix, Arizona, its public transportation is better but still not efficient if you need to rely on it all of the time (I used it in Colorado to go Downtown Denver and things like that, but when I first moved there and tried to not have a car and go to work... it was a nightmare.)

However, when I moved to the UK, I didn't buy a car. I ran out of time to get a UK driver's license. But I have been so impressed (with mild annoyances, which are to be expected at times) with Britain's public transport that I have just had no need. The only time I have driven here was when my mom visited in October 2007. She rented a car and I drove us to Edinburgh and then to Glastonbury. But, otherwise, I go to work, and every other little thing that requires any sort of traveling beyond my own two feet, using public transport. It is A+ to me. Have been using it for over two years now!

I think if the US had begun setting up some sort of system to connect everything (granted, on a broader, more vast way) decades and decades and decades ago... we may not have the lack of decent public transportation that we have now.

It's nice that the UK is so overall small, as it makes this sort of thing work. But if this was set up in a similar way in each state (although I wish it had been started YEEEEEEEEEARS ago), it would be brilliant!

I would LOVE to be able to just hop on a train in Phoenix and go up to Flagstaff and not drive.

It will never happen, though. Maybe...

I think if the US had begun setting up some sort of system to connect everything (granted, on a broader, more vast way) decades and decades and decades ago... we may not have the lack of decent public transportation that we have now.

Back in the early part of the 20th century there were many more streetcar systems in American cities, and where those cities were relatively close, there were many instances of tracks being constructed for several miles across the rural area between the two cities so that the streetcars could operate over longer distances linking the two towns together.   These systems became known as Interurbans.   Unfortunately, they started to decline rapidly when the automobile really took off from the 1930s onward, although some survived until the 1960s.

if you live outside London, especially in smaller cities: you will need a car, the public transport is unreliable and expensive.

  Where on earth did you get that idea? 

We live far from London, don't have a car, and we do just fine.  My husband cycles to work, and I can get wherever I need to go via bus, train, or my own two feet.  I usually walk everywhere, and that obviously doesn't cost a thing. 

If we lived somewhere rural, then I could see owning a car.  But it's really not necessary for everyone outside of London. 

I saw something on TV tonight about a "car club" where people can go online to rent cars that are parked around their neighborhoods, drive them for an hour or so to do their shopping, then drop them off again.  They reckon that people who don't drive much (<6,000 miles/year) can save upwards of £3,000 if they use the car club rather than owning their own car. 

Just from my own experience, I've never had a driving license, and finding transportation is the biggest hassle in my life.  If you don't drive you can be severely limited with regard to where you can work, where you can live, and what you can do.  I've managed to survive up to this point by living in cities or near my work, and by depending on the kindness of my friends and family (which I hate). I lived in Prague for a while, and the extensive network of subway, tram, and buses was absolute heaven.  By contrast, when I lived in California, there was a period of a few months where I had to have someone drive me to a bus stop at 7am, ride a bus for an hour, wait, catch another bus, then walk 4 miles to get to work.  I'd arrive around 10.  If I had been able to drive myself, it would have taken about 30 minutes.  But now that I live in rural England, it's worth it to hunker down and get my license, then get a car.  I know there's congestion and it's bad for the environment, but I'm really looking forward to having a bit of freedom from the tyranny of bus schedules, and to not wearing out my shoes so quickly.   

Paul,
If you were interested in the decline of the public transpoartation in the US there is a lot written about the conspiracy of the major auto companies to buy the various public transportation companies in the cities and then strip them so they went out of business. It was not known at the time but it has come to light in the last few years.

Historyenne,
If you research UK Yankee you can read about this subject because it was discussed on the forum. I didn't know a system of using cars was available in the US and UK so it was interesting to me.
http://www.eartheasy.com/live_car_sharing.htm