Lots of Questions:How do we reach our goal of being married + living in the UK?

I met my amazing British boyfriend two and a half years ago, and we both knew there was something really special between us right off the bat.  However, I was still in school in America (studying abroad when we met) and he had just graduated, and I was dating someone else back in The States, so for two years we wrote each other friendly letters and just got to know each other.  He became one of my best friends, even though we only communicated through the letters.

In January, I decided to go visit him in England, and we found the same incredible instant connection as we had when we first met.  Both of us were finally single, and I guess the two years of repressed emotions were released, and we let ourselves go and fell absolutely head over feet for each other.  We have since been learning how incredibly compatible we are, in a romantic situation in addition to the already really special friendship, and are incredibly in awe of each other and our love.  We've done a lot of thinking and dreaming about starting a life and family together.   We have been asking the realistic questions, too, and we know it can work and that it's worth all the effort.  Forgive me if all this sounds cheesy = D

I've also lived most of my life in various locations overseas, so while all of the red tape of the visa application process does seem a bit daunting, I am much more comfortable with picking up and starting a new life than I might otherwise be.

So, our big question is: How exactly do we reach our goal of being married and living in the UK?

At first I thought I could come visit in the summer for a month or two, just to make sure we got along being together every day for a long period of time, but I would definitely lose my job if I tried to take a month off, and then it would be necessary to find another one and have it for 3-6 months (am I right in thinking on the application you have to include at least 3 months of pay stubs?) before applying for a fiance visa.  Which I could do, seeing as I was about to look for another job anyway, and just time it so I can take a month off between them...but then I read that I might have issues at the border if I'm unemployed.  I'm 22 by the way, graduated from college last May. Just trying to make the picture clearer so I can get the right advice. = )  Another separate thought- I actually work in Theatre, as a stage manager, and although I have a full-time year-round salaried position right now, there is a possibility of me leaving that job and really becoming a freelance stage manager.  Would that make our visa application more difficult to be approve? I imagine that I could find somewhat steady work, but there would be weeks of not working.  And how do you document that on the VAF?

So...can I visit him for a long period of time (1-2 months) without getting in trouble?

Or should we just go ahead and apply for a fiance visa a few months down the road?

Also, how many visits are recommended before applying for the fiance visa?  I can prove that we saw each other in September 2006 and January 2009 so far...and that we have had constant contact between those dates and since then, including about 200 emails in the last two months alone.  If I go in March, and he has a trip planned here in April, will 3 trips be enough to go ahead and file for the fiance visa?

I also wanted to go spend the weekend with him March 5-9.  Is that going to be an issue at the border since I was just there in January?

We would obviously love to date under normal circumstances, but we are absolutely sure that we are right for each other and can make each other happy.

We will probably have a whole new round of questions after we decide what to do in the upcoming months...but the answers to these questions should get us started on the path.  I have been doing a lot of reading on the pros/cons of getting married in the US then applying for spousal visa/versus applying for fiance visa and getting married in the UK, and that will be one of my big questions too.

Sorry if I asked too many questions in one post! Thanks so much for taking the time to read about us and we look forward to the advice!

-B+H

Well, first step, F&S, is to pay attention to time zones. It's one in the morning in the UK, so you probably won't get any sensible responses for a while 

I don't count this response as a sensible one, as it is late and I am tiddly, but I wanted to welcome you to the board. Here, all your questions will be answered.

In a few hours...

Hah, some of us are just natural night owls   

Forkandspoon, if you have pictures from your visits, letters and/or e-mails to each other and records of any phone calls that should be enough for the fiance visa . . .  but I'll still do my broken record imitation and say that it would be cheaper and easier to get married in the US, especially if you are sure about marriage and your boyfriend has a trip to the US planned anyway.  It would sort out your job issues too, since you can work immediately in the UK on a spouse visa. 

But good luck to you, whatever you decide!

I'd go with historyenne on this one, F&S.

My fiance and I are getting married in 6 weeks here in the states, then I'll be applying for my spousal visa the day after we're married (I can get my certificate same day or next day since we're getting married at a courthouse and where I live they allow that), and then HOPEFULLY if turnover is fast I'll have my visa before he leaves here and I can go back with him to England (I'm already packing my things too during the waiting period).  But really, it was the more sensible thing for my fiance and I to do.  Save money while planning the wedding, and getting my life together, etc....then I can get a job as soon as I'm ready in England instead of having to wait if we were to have gone the fiance visa route. 

But, there are some people that I've met and become friends with on here that have gone the fiance visa route.  I guess it all depends on if you have the patience to wait a little bit longer to be with the one you're madly in love with.  Good luck though with your journey, and please keep us posted on your decision.

I'm going to add my vote to the spousal visa column. I met my fiance while working abroad and when I had to come back, we looked into basically every option - fiance visa, my going back to London for grad school, etc. The fiance visa does sound like a great thing except that you can't work while you're on it, and for us at least, that would be just completely out of the question.
It does feel like such a daunting task to get married and then have to wait for the visa, but getting married in the US and then applying for the visa really seems to be the most straightforward way to go about things. For us anyway!! If you can afford not to work while you're over there on a fiance visa then it sounds great. I'm still figuring everything out for a spousal visa - getting married in July - so I'm definitely no expert.
No matter which way you choose to do things, it all means waiting and missing each other and huge ass phone bills for a while , but even the time apart is amazing when you're planning out your life. It's all very exciting
Good luck to you!! And really, even more important than what your plan ends up being is just having a plan. Having something to look forward to makes all the difference.
And someone will have to confirm this, but I don't think you'll have a problem visiting him in March, especially since it's just for a few days. I don't think the frequency of your visits really matters.
Going for a month means you really have to prove you have the funds to support yourself for that amount of time, and you have to prove ties to the US - a job to go back to, an apartment,etc. So that's maybe a bit more tricky, but not impossible.

Good luck!!

I'm defintely with most people on her endorsing a spousal visa. That's the route I'm going with my fiance in May--he's coming to visit for a couple of weeks, we get married, I go for my biometrics appointment, then mail everything in. I probably won't be able to fly back with him since we're getting married a week before he leaves, and it'll kill me to say goodbye when the time comes, but it seems to be the most direct route to long-term residence in the UK if you plan on getting married. I thought at first I'd go the fiance visa route, but we decided not to spend the money to switch visas if we didn't have to--plus my family won't fly to the UK for a wedding anyway, so might as well have it here

No matter which way you choose to do things, it all means waiting and missing each other and huge ass phone bills for a while , but even the time apart is amazing when you're planning out your life. It's all very exciting
Good luck to you!! And really, even more important than what your plan ends up being is just having a plan. Having something to look forward to makes all the difference.

Quoting this for truth. Having a plan gives you hope, and that can be what gets you two through the time of being apart, even after you're married. It's planning everything, and making concrete steps towards being together that makes the time go by faster

Hi F&S, and welcome to UKY.

I'm going to be the lone voice of dissent (so far, anyway) and recommend the fiancee visa.  Sure, the method the others mentioned (getting married in the US, then applying for the spousal before moving to the UK) is cheaper - but if it's time that you want, time to sort things out and make sure you're compatible, and y'all have enough savings/enough income to a) qualify for the visa, b) sustain yourselves without you working until you get hitched and c) pay for the additional visa, then the fiancee visa will give you that time.

DH and I were together for two and a half years before I moved to the UK - during that time, we saw each other every two months, for two weeks at a stretch.  We'd spent over six months together combined - but no trip was longer than a fortnight.  We elected to apply for the fiancee visa so that we could experience living together for longer than a fortnight before getting married, even though we were pretty damn sure that was what we wanted.  It was more difficult that I expected to be out of work for that long, and it was a serious drain on our finances, but I don't regret taking that extra time to make sure.

Hello (lengthy response matching OP)

I went for the fiance visa as well, because it gave us time to adjust to the idea of marriage, made it feel less forced and more like something we were giving ourselves time to decide upon, rather than solely a means to an end. Yes, it sucks not working, psychologically and financially. However, aren't fiancees allowed to take classes (someone please correct me if I'm wrong!!!)?

If you can prove you intend to marry and have a relationship with ongoing contact (phone bills/email screenshots are fine), there is no minimum number of visits before they see your relationship as genuine (at least, for Americans that is). Provided you can prove you have a place to live (ie tenancy agreement or mortgage, permission from the landlord or owner for you to live there if the place isn't his) and HE can show previous bank statements, you should be alright. 

It is his job in the UK & his bank account that they will be focusing on, and your employment will only be significant in a)helping you have more money to show for the application, and b) proving that you will be eventually employable in the UK. It is favorable for you to have been recently employed at time of app, but not necessary. I wasn't. Also, don't worry too much about the details of your employment. Including a copy of your degree, CV and/or employer references, paystubs/contract from past employment, etc will be more than enough to show what you're capable of earning.

Anyway, that said, spousal visas are a lot easier as far as accompanying evidence goes-- there is less ECO scrutiny on your financial situation because the assumption is you'll be working, and there is no need to prove the relationship.

If you decide to visit before you apply for the visa, you should be fine. Obviously, the longer you intend to stay, the more you have to fight to prove you are a genuine visitor. You were there for less than a month & returned home when you said you would, and as long as you can show you have a return ticket, proof of funds, ties to the US, and are honest about your relationship, all of those things would be in your favor.

A visit of a week or two when you still have a job to go back to will be easier than a month or two with no job at home. Also keep in mind that it will be easier coming in as a visitor with an imminent US wedding than with a future UK wedding. In fact, trying the latter will probably get you bounced because technically you should have a fiance visa.

After all this advice, though, the best thing I think is to just go with your gut. If it's telling you you have enough paperwork to show at the border, and you know how to present yourself, what to say (ie explaining that he is visiting YOU next, and you are taking a couple weeks off before your next job starts, etc) and what not to, then you could be ok with a longer visit.

The forum is good for learning the rules and keeping as informed as possible about your different options, but in the end you can't let it all scare you because then it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. For every horror story posted on the forum, I'm sure there are many more success stories that we never hear about.

Good luck!

Di

There...I'm awake now. We did the fiancee route, as well. My DH hates to fly and never visited me in the States, so it was a no brainer.

We have moved to a very small, close-knit community in the country. Getting married in the UK meant we could get married in our local church and invite some of the neighbors. It  was helpful to us socially.

But that is one more visa, with all the expense and hassle. And the wait. Bit of a luxury, really.

My husband and I went the fiance visa route and got married in the UK. For our situation it made more sense as we did a small ceremony at a registry office in the UK and plan on a bigger celebration with friends in the next 12-18 months in the States. We didn't mind that he was the only one able to work at the time because we were finally through with the distance and we could be together. His parents ended up (thankfully) helping with the cost of the FLR(M) as a wedding gift so I was able to start working within a couple weeks of getting married.

One thing I will say is that if you're planning on being employed in the UK, start eyeballing for work now. It's tough with the economy at the moment and depending on your line of work, it may not be so easy to get a job right away should you choose to marry in the States and get a spousal visa.

Good luck!!

I'm very glad DJ has mentioend the finances.  There is no point in even thinking about which option is best until you have clarified that you actually qualify...and without knowing his salary and both your savings, there is no way of knowing.

Vicky

Thank you all so much for your wisdom and advice!  I'm so happy I found this forum! 

VictoriaS: I am pretty certain we have the financial standing to qualify for the fiance route, and I think we could handle the six months or more of me being unemployed, but I will definitely dig around some more and see what information I can find on the subject. 

My next big question is this: if we choose to get married in the States, could we run into any potential trouble with his UK citizenship?  When we show up to get a marriage license, does he just bring his passport and UK birth certificate and no questions are asked? And what would he state at the US border, that he's just visiting?  Or does he need some sort of visa to allow us to be married here, even though we're returning to the UK?

One other quick question: we do most of our communicating on iChat because it is free and it's video- but there is no hard bill or anything to prove our contact.  We write about 30 emails back and forth a day, and he calls my work phone once or twice a day from Skype, but should we be shelling out the extra dough to call from real phones so that there is more hard evidence of our contact?

So far we have booked the tickets for the first weekend in March, and we'll definitely keep everyone posted and probably ask lots more questions!

-b&h

As far as I know (I'm having my UK fiance come over in May to get married here in the States--I'm not an expert, but I have asked those same questions) the only things he will need are his passport, birth certificate, and any divorce papers if he's been married before. Most local authorities don't care as long as the person is in the country on a valid visa, and they aren't currently married.

As for what to tell immigration, my fiance will just say he's on holiday--they generally don't ask him too many questions because he has his son with him and has good ties to the UK, plus a clean immigration history to the US so far.

That's what I've been told so far, but I'm sure there's people on here that have more experience than I do

One other quick question: we do most of our communicating on iChat because it is free and it's video- but there is no hard bill or anything to prove our contact.  We write about 30 emails back and forth a day, and he calls my work phone once or twice a day from Skype, but should we be shelling out the extra dough to call from real phones so that there is more hard evidence of our contact?

There is a popular mis-conception that you have to have this huge mountain of paperwork to prove to the UK that there is a a relationshionship to get either a fiancé(e) visa or spousal visa.  This is not the case.  You have to be ready to prove that you a) have met each other and b) you either intend to get married or are married depending on which visa you are applying for.  On Garry's site, he speaks about "interveaning devotion", but in large, for applicaints from the US this is seldom an issue.  The official guidance states the following:

• you plan to marry or register a civil partnership within a reasonable time (usually six months)
• you plan to live together permanently after you are married or have registered a civil partnership
• you have met each other before
• there is somewhere for you and your dependants to live until you get married or register a civil partnership, and you will be able to live without help from public funds, and
• you and your dependants can be supported without working or claiming any help from public funds.

VictoriaS: I am pretty certain we have the financial standing to qualify for the fiance route, and I think we could handle the six months or more of me being unemployed,

You wouldn't need to be unemployed for six months.

Vicky