Pledge of Allegiance

...I think it's a good life lesson that sometimes you keep your mouth shut regardless of your personal opinion - particularly when it comes to your profession.

I can appreciate where you're coming from, and would feel equally annoyed if kids were being disrespectful. I do believe in showing respect for other people!

Schools will never drop the pledge regardless of how pointless or scary it is to some people.  Administration is FULL of the people that BD is talking about, who define themselves (or least want the world to define them) as flag waving, God fearing, salt of the earth Americans.

I'm sure you're right here. But I'm not just questioning it because I think it's pointless; but rather that my kid has NO IDEA what the heck these words mean. And hearing a school full of kids reciting very difficult words in unison is a little creepy to me.

I'm sure you're right here. But I'm not just questioning it because I think it's pointless; but rather that my kid has NO IDEA what the heck these words mean. And hearing a school full of kids reciting very difficult words in unison is a little creepy to me.

We don't need no education.... We don't need no thought control....
I've got visions of meat grinders in my heat 

Actually, I think there are states where saying the pledge is required unless there is a conflict with religion or a parent writes a note.

ETA: Here's a link to a chart showing each state's requirements. http://undergod.procon.org/viewbackgroundresource.asp?ResourceID=811

I think we would write a note saying our child would not have to say the pledge unless s/he wanted to due to conflict of citizenship.

I'm sure you're right here. But I'm not just questioning it because I think it's pointless; but rather that my kid has NO IDEA what the heck these words mean. And hearing a school full of kids reciting very difficult words in unison is a little creepy to me.

I agree.  I never thought about it when I was in school, but now it's disturbing, and I really did resent it at first.  Eventually, it was just a routine again.   

... learning how to tow the line for the greater social good and out of respect for other people.  You don't HAVE to say it.  You don't HAVE to pray....  Have your rebellion in your head and then get on with the rest of day. 

Yeah, that kind of explains my experience as a 10 year old.  Whilst not feeling forced to pledge a phony allegiance that I didn't believe in, I was reading about the Scopes trial, which led me to read about Darwin's theory, which led me to realise I was an atheist.

Dangerous stuff indeed.

Actually, I think there are states where saying the pledge is required unless there is a conflict with religion or a parent writes a note.

ETA: Here's a link to a chart showing each state's requirements. http://undergod.procon.org/viewbackgroundresource.asp?ResourceID=811

I think we would write a note saying our child would not have to say the pledge unless s/he wanted to due to conflict of citizenship.

That's interesting.  I didn't realise it was state by state. 

That's interesting.  I didn't realise it was state by state. 

I didn't either. That explains why I had to do the pledge here in MA, but not in TN, though. I also thought the laws about flags in classrooms was interesting.

Vermont isn't on there at all.  Or am I missing it?

I see it as a respect issue - learning how to tow the line for the greater social good and out of respect for other people.  You don't HAVE to say it.  You don't HAVE to pray.  But you should remain quiet and respectful of the moment.  Have your rebellion in your head and then get on with the rest of day.  I think it's a good life lesson that sometimes you keep your mouth shut regardless of your personal opinion - particularly when it comes to your profession.

I think that sums up my feelings.  And also I don't really have a problem with kids reciting something that may be above their heads -- and maybe that's because its something I grew up with.  If my kids were being made to recite something new and questionable that would be another story.  Not very consistent but there you are: it is about our feelings and emotions one way or another when you get down to it.

Vermont isn't on there at all.  Or am I missing it?

According to other areas of that website, Vermont has no laws regarding the pledge or flag display.