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What name should we give this thread?

Weigh to Go
3 (27.3%)
Healthy and Fit
4 (36.4%)
Fit for Life
0 (0%)
Fat Fighters
2 (18.2%)
Fitness Matters
1 (9.1%)
Get the Skinny
1 (9.1%)

Total Members Voted: 10

Voting closed: February 13, 2011, 04:14:42 PM


Topic: Healthy and Fit  (Read 131922 times)

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    • Jennifer Knits
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Re: Healthy and Fit
« Reply #690 on: October 13, 2010, 12:32:57 PM »
I watched a lecture from the head of the pediatrition department at UCSF who talked a lot about how since the 1980s obesity rates have skyrocketed because everyone went on low-fat diets and in order to make processed foods taste good without fat they added tons and tons of sugar which your body processes as fats. So in essence everyone went on super-high-fat diets (different from a full-fat diet) and gained a ton of weight. It's online...uh, here:
http://www.uctv.tv/search-details.aspx?showID=16717 or
Sugar: The Bitter Truth

It's 90 minutes and full of O-Chem, but I found it really interesting.


Re: Healthy and Fit
« Reply #691 on: October 13, 2010, 12:40:21 PM »
If you're interested in that, noirem, I'd suggest you look into Gary Taubes' writing.  He's also got a few lectures online.  There's also the Metabolism Society in the States (to which this paediatrician is likely a member).


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    • Jennifer Knits
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Re: Healthy and Fit
« Reply #692 on: October 13, 2010, 12:56:42 PM »
If you're interested in that, noirem, I'd suggest you look into Gary Taubes' writing.  He's also got a few lectures online.  There's also the Metabolism Society in the States (to which this paediatrician is likely a member).

Doing a quick google search on his name, I find myself inclined to disagree with anyone who says exercise is useless as a diet tool. I do think that the only way to lose weight is to eat less (calories) because an hour of strenuous exercise burns so few calories compared to what you get from one extra cookie, but I don't think the benefits of exercise for health (as opposed to weight loss) can be stressed enough and if one is not dieting to be healthy then one may need to reconsider one's motives.

Wow that was a long sentence. Anyhoo, thank you for the recommendation, I'll dig up some of his articles :)


Re: Healthy and Fit
« Reply #693 on: October 13, 2010, 01:16:50 PM »
He doesn't say that exercise is useless. A lot of people have misconstrued a small part of his book and claim that is what he said. He says that the evidence points to the idea that it might increase the appetite, and that we might overcompensate especially if we're "intuitively" eating.  For the super-morbidly obese, it might be better to focus on getting the weight down before focusing on exercise as the risks might outweigh the benefits, and nowhere does he claim that any evidence points to exercise as a bad thing.  Rather, he says there are plenty of reasons to be active for health reasons and is very physically active himself.  

Basically, he's not a nutritionist or dietitian and doesn't claim to be either.  He's a science journalist with a degree in physics. He's compiled the evidence for and against the hypothesis that dietary fat causes obesity or ill health, whether saturated or not, and the role of dietary sugar (including complex carbohydrates) in obesity.  He doesn't claim to be a diet guru, but for some reason he is painted as one by his detractors.  And even if one or more of his conclusions he bases on the scientific evidence is wrong, it doesn't mean all his conclusions are wrong.  Nor does he paint his conclusions as scientific fact, unlike many others who will talk in terms of "common knowledge".

Nutritional science is just the latest of the science debates that he's reported upon.  He started out doing articles and books on things like the Nobel Prize and cold fusion.  He got into writing about nutritional science when he investigated the evidence about dietary sodium intake warnings, moved onto dietary cholesterol, and then onto fat.  His book is pretty interesting if you can tolerate science based texts.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2010, 01:20:10 PM by Legs Akimbo »


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Re: Healthy and Fit
« Reply #694 on: October 13, 2010, 02:01:12 PM »
My hubby's trainer would much rather he use full fat milk than low fat or skim, and this was even back when he was trying to lose weight as well as build muscle.

This is very off topic, but one of my pet peeves is not being able to use full fat milk in my coffee--I'd rather use full fat soy milk than skim milk!  Our friends, lovely lovely people they are really love their cheese and eat lots of it, but they only ever have skim milk in the fridge.  Next time we stay over, I'm tempted to bring my own full fat milk.

Yeah, I definitely prefer full fat milk in my tea and coffee. It's terrible with skimmed milk.  [smiley=bleck.gif] Yet, I don't usually mind eating cereal with skimmed milk. Still, I do find that whole milk makes me feel much more full from a bowl of cereal, and lasts longer, than using skimmed milk. I also use real butter on things and eat full fat cheese. I guess anything really goes so long as you make sure you aren't eating too much. But that's always my downfall!  :P


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    • Jennifer Knits
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Re: Healthy and Fit
« Reply #695 on: October 13, 2010, 02:06:53 PM »
He doesn't say that exercise is useless. A lot of people have misconstrued a small part of his book and claim that is what he said. He says that the evidence points to the idea that it might increase the appetite, and that we might overcompensate especially if we're "intuitively" eating.  For the super-morbidly obese, it might be better to focus on getting the weight down before focusing on exercise as the risks might outweigh the benefits, and nowhere does he claim that any evidence points to exercise as a bad thing.  Rather, he says there are plenty of reasons to be active for health reasons and is very physically active himself.  

I almost went back and added "Wow that was a long sentence, based on a quote that was probably taken out of context anyway" but I didn't 'cause I had finally got the momentum to do my exercise video :) I was sincere in thanking you for the tip.


Re: Healthy and Fit
« Reply #696 on: October 13, 2010, 02:14:59 PM »
I almost went back and added "Wow that was a long sentence, based on a quote that was probably taken out of context anyway" but I didn't 'cause I had finally got the momentum to do my exercise video :) I was sincere in thanking you for the tip.

I know you were.  Excuse my lack of social graces for coming off a bit strong about the defence of Taubes. You might also be interested in Weston Price's work.  Although old, it's pretty interesting stuff.  I can't vouch for the modern followers of WP, and I've always found a lot of the online followers of Nourishing Traditions a bit weird and off-putting, but I think that they might be onto something.  Plus, their diet is a bit more "normal" than most LC plans in that they eat dairy if tolerated (although usually raw), whole grains (usually sprouted), and lots of fruits and veg along with things like the fermented and traditional foods. 


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Re: Healthy and Fit
« Reply #697 on: October 13, 2010, 03:07:19 PM »
Heh, there's a video on youtube that shows my guy yelling at your guy except the "yelling" appears to be "you didn't go deep enough into the problems with fructose" as opposed to any sort of name calling or quackery :)

Here's another video from UCSF, another 90min one, from a Dr Robert Baron, "Obesity: 10 Things You Thought You Knew" which is really interesting as well. The part that seems relevent to this conversation is when he's comparing studies based on different diets (WW, Atkins, something vegan, South Beach, etc) and how basically what they have in common is that you stop eating refined sugars, and without necessarily talking about it, they all recommend cutting 500 calories/day, and they all yield around the same results - the same success rates and the same rates of people giving up. So the only real thing with picking a restrictive diet seems to be finding one you can stick with. Then someone in the audience asked about the Mediterranean Diet (high in veg. fats like avocados) and Dr Baron said the rates of loss did seem to be higher but he wasn't able to compile enough data on it to include in his presentation.
http://www.uctv.tv/search-details.aspx?showID=16713


Re: Healthy and Fit
« Reply #698 on: October 13, 2010, 03:41:13 PM »
I think what people ignore when they dismiss the weight loss effects of low carb as purely to do with reduction of calories is that it actually helps people regulate their calories better.  It's not that I don't get hungry when I am on low carb.  I just have more will power.  I could easily find the extra calories to make up for the sugars and starches, I just tend not to even want to.  I think that heavy people generally don't have broken metabolisms (although this might be a part of it) or poor will power.  I think they have broken calorie regulators.  The hunger I get when I am eating a lot of carbs and sugar is a lot different than the hunger I feel when I am eating a very few.  It's not an emotional hunger either.  FFS, it's not like any emotional problems go away when I am on low carb.

I do think low sugar diets are the answer.  That is why I don't think that people have to reduce their overall carbs totally to lose weight.  They need to reduce their refined sugar (and flour) intake.  Most diets do this (as that guy said) through restriction.  That doesn't mean there aren't further benefits with LC.  And most proponents of LC (and these aren't the ones pushing fake LC foods, but ones that believe in whole low carb foods) believe there are other health benefits to eating that way.

Right now I am not really doing low carb.  I am trying not to eat refined sugar and to limit the amount of refined carbs I am eating.  I just don't feel in the right place at the moment with my mother's death (and not to mention the cost of the funeral, flights, etc) to worry about the planning and cost of LC.  I've not given up losing weight.  I am being really careful on the amounts I eat, but if I do eat too many carbs, I end up miserable and feeling like I am denying myself as I have tonnes of cravings.  I feel like I need comfort food, so that is what I am giving myself.  I just don't think comfort food always has to come in the form of white, processed flours, white potato mash, pasta, or sugary stuff.  I will worry about going back on LC some time in the future.


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Re: Healthy and Fit
« Reply #699 on: October 13, 2010, 05:39:13 PM »
By the way, I did well yesterday and have stuck to my guns today, and have all my meals planned for tomorrow, as well. I walked up the street and bought lots of fresh fruit and veg which had been reduced so I will be eating much healthier this week, plus controlling portions accordingly. And I went for an hour long walk yesterday and today, apparently burning 204 calories each time, according to my route mapper thingymajig.  :) And I weighed myself this morning and looked about 4 pounds lighter than Monday afternoon, so that makes me feel better. I think I will just go with the morning figure.  ;)


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Re: Healthy and Fit
« Reply #700 on: October 13, 2010, 07:59:36 PM »
Jewlz, you may loose inches but not weight, an indication of improved health & fitness. Keep chipping away at the healthy eating and keeping moving!  [smiley=2thumbsup.gif]

Walked home today. The weather was glorious.  :D 


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Re: Healthy and Fit
« Reply #701 on: October 13, 2010, 08:06:11 PM »
Jewlz, you may loose inches but not weight, an indication of improved health & fitness. Keep chipping away at the healthy eating and keeping moving!  [smiley=2thumbsup.gif]

Walked home today. The weather was glorious.  :D 

Definitely! I have to say that exercising is much easier now than it was before I quit smoking. I was able to jog for a bit yesterday and it wasn't too bad... I made it further than I ever would have as a smoker, even though I've gained weight!  ;D [smiley=2thumbsup.gif]


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Re: Healthy and Fit
« Reply #702 on: October 13, 2010, 08:10:14 PM »
Definitely! I have to say that exercising is much easier now than it was before I quit smoking. I was able to jog for a bit yesterday and it wasn't too bad... I made it further than I ever would have as a smoker, even though I've gained weight!  ;D [smiley=2thumbsup.gif]

Yay for happy lungs. That is so much more important than weight.   :D


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Re: Healthy and Fit
« Reply #703 on: October 13, 2010, 08:19:31 PM »
Yay for happy lungs. That is so much more important than weight.   :D

Indeed!  :)
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Re: Healthy and Fit
« Reply #704 on: October 14, 2010, 01:09:31 AM »

This is very off topic, but one of my pet peeves is not being able to use full fat milk in my coffee--I'd rather use full fat soy milk than skim milk!  Our friends, lovely lovely people they are really love their cheese and eat lots of it, but they only ever have skim milk in the fridge.  Next time we stay over, I'm tempted to bring my own full fat milk.

I bought full fat the other day b/c it was late and aldi was there and thats what they had...
DH said ohh WOW I never buy that it goes bad faster....I never looked but I think full fat expires quick? So DH always buy 2%.  When he is off shore I buy the one in the white carton that lasts longer since I only use for coffee really ;-)

Totally off topic sorry ;-)



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