US Adverts on National Healthcare

I think the bill has many good points, but we'll see what happens. It does claim to be cost neutral, but we'd have to wait and see what the CBO says. The point is reforming healthcare to be more affordable for everyone, preserve the quality of care we enjoy, and have more freedom of choice. Here is a direct quote from the Q&A section:

I'm always one for reading the bill. He can claim it to be 'cost neutral' but the bill itself allocates billions of dollars to reform and (for lack of better words) handouts without also setting a source for that funding. In other words, it will increase individual taxes (even though it gives a monthly healthcare tax credit of $2290 per adult and no more than $5710 per family). That's increased spending and (theoretically) cutting taxes without any source to fund such a venture. Guess who's going to get that bill? They can claim that they're redirecting tax funds, so that means that something else is going to be cut, the deficit increases, and/or taxes will increase to offset the cost. The only way they can work those numbers is if they hire the accountants from Enron.
Secondly, it pumps billions of dollars into Medicare, which everyone seems to agree it needs fixing. However, if one wants to be about 'free markets', then the best fix would be letting Medicare negotiate prices. Throwing money at Medicare won't fix it. I can agree with you that the Dem bill, HR 3200, has problems and potentially harmful pieces. However, I can't say that Coburn's bill is any better, or to use one of the magic buzzwords, financially sustainable.

I can agree with you that the Dem bill, HR 3200, has problems and potentially harmful pieces. However, I can't say that Coburn's bill is any better, or to use one of the magic buzzwords, financially sustainable.

I'm always one for reading the bills as well, as I feel that's part of my job as a citizen. From what I can see, Coburn's bill has many parts to it that I would support, however, not if the cost is unsustainable (such as HR3200). I don't actually think HR3200 will pass as it's written, so we'll have to see what happens in the next few months. Also, I would rather wait to see what the CBO determines about Coburn's bill before I decide that it's too costly.

I'm always one for reading the bills as well, as I feel that's part of my job as a citizen. From what I can see, Coburn's bill has many parts to it that I would support, however, not if the cost is unsustainable (such as HR3200). I don't actually think HR3200 will pass as it's written, so we'll have to see what happens in the next few months. Also, I would rather wait to see what the CBO determines about Coburn's bill before I decide that it's too costly.

jw66 - Do you live in the US now?  Are you planning on moving to the UK?  Or have you lived in the UK and returned to the US?

The Dems are the group in TOTAL charge at the moment, btw, and they've done a very poor job presenting this bill to the people. They're not united as a party behind it and are sending mixed messages all over the place.

Yet they don't operate in a vacuum, now, do they?

GOP accused of health reform 'fear-mongering'

WASHINGTON - The national Republican Party has mailed a fundraising appeal suggesting Democrats might use an overhaul of the health care system to deny medical treatment to Republicans.

A questionnaire accompanying the appeal says the government could check voting registration records, "prompting fears that GOP voters might be discriminated against for medical treatment in a Democrat-imposed health care rationing system."

Katie Wright, a spokeswoman for the Republican National Committee, said the question was "inartfully worded."

"Inartfully worded."  That's good.

Yet they don't operate in a vacuum, now, do they?

Sorry Carl, this is your party's watch (president, house, and senate) and their bill.  The party is not united behind it or winning over American confidence in their plan. If reform fails (and it well might) they have only themselves to blame:

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5il892mEYzWO1CD8hZVloHcT8OukAD9ACI4D80

Do I think there has been an effective campaign from the other side to defeat this bill? Very much so!! I also feel that it's obvious that this would have happened. How out of touch can this administration be toward the mood of the country and it's mistrust in the government? Given all of our other problems at the moment and all the debt we're accumulating, this was not the time to introduce this.

Also Carl, before you decide again to assume my personal life and situation for my views, know that I am currently paying down the 30% share that health insurance didn't cover for my daughter's extensive ICU hospitalization last January. It's been very difficult financially for me to do so, and I'm not sure if I can continue. I DO want reform, but not at the sake of a future mess that's worse than the current one. When there is a bill on the table that SERIOUSLY addresses heathcare/insurance reform and a way to sustain it's cost, believe me I'll be one of it's most vocal supporters.

Again with this?

[MOD NOTE]
Either debate the issue or don't debate at all.  Leave your own hurt feelings out of it.

Nobody is attacking YOU.  They are, however, disagreeing with what you are saying.  If you can't handle that then you need to step back from the debate.

Any questions or comments PM me, but this portion of the debate is closed and anymore discussion on whether or not you were personally attacked will be deleted.

Also Carl, before you decide again to assume my personal life and situation for my views....

I thought Mindy's post was clear.  Why do you keep insisting - in this case preemptively - that you're being attacked?

Sorry Carl, this is your party's watch (president, house, and senate) and their bill.  The party is not united behind it or winning over American confidence in their plan. If reform fails (and it well might) they have only themselves to blame:

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5il892mEYzWO1CD8hZVloHcT8OukAD9ACI4D80

Do I think there has been an effective campaign from the other side to defeat this bill? Very much so!! I also feel that it's obvious that this would have happened. How out of touch can this administration be toward the mood of the country and it's mistrust in the government? Given all of our other problems at the moment and all the debt we're accumulating, this was not the time to introduce this.

Also Carl, before you decide again to assume my personal life and situation for my views, know that I am currently paying down the 30% share that health insurance didn't cover for my daughter's extensive ICU hospitalization last January. It's been very difficult financially for me to do so, and I'm not sure if I can continue. I DO want reform, but not at the sake of a future mess that's worse than the current one. When there is a bill on the table that SERIOUSLY addresses heathcare/insurance reform and a way to sustain it's cost, believe me I'll be one of it's most vocal supporters.

If your daughter had been in a country with nationalized medicine, you wouldn't have that crushing debt (or what appears to be your allusion to a potential bankruptcy).

It's also noteworthy to point out that when the NHS began, Great Britain was nearly bankrupt (and the NHS was a MUCH larger undertaking that what our administration is proposing).  The US is not in the financial situation that Great Britain was in 1948.  Arguments that 'this is not the time' for reform because of economics in the US are not fortified historically by that argument.

If your daughter had been in a country with nationalized medicine, you wouldn't have that crushing debt (or what appears to be your allusion to a potential bankruptcy).

I do realize this, but this can also be the case with other forms of healthcare/health insurance reform. I feel that this needs to be done right, and I'm not confident in the current bill being proposed.

I do realize this, but this can also be the case with other forms of healthcare/health insurance reform. I feel that this needs to be done right, and I'm not confident in the current bill being proposed.

How can any reform be worse than what we have now?

I am a 'gatekeeper' for a health care facility. I take your insurance information. I call your company. I find out what your coverage is - or is not. I call you up. I tell you what will be covered and what will not. You make a decision.

If you could see the HUGE disparities in coverage - you would be nauseous. And it goes WAY beyond 100% coverage or 90/10 or 80/20. I see no deductibles; $250 deductibles; $1500 dedutibles; $6000 deductibles. I see out-of-pocket expenses as high as $10000. I see visit limits. I see restrictions as to the diagnosis code. I see pre-existing periods. I see PER DAY limits as to what a company will pay for a certain service. I see TOTAL CASH payouts a company will pay for a single diagnosis. I see annual maximums and lifetime maximums. I see no coverage at all for certain types of services. The list goes on and on.

I wonder as I work all day long what these people are paying as their contribution of the premium. I hear the cracking in their voice as they decline service. I file their paperwork away in an expandable folder in my desk drawer in case they change their mind. They don't. After the folder gets too heavy for me to lift, I take the paperwork to Medical Records where they retain it for a year or so. Eventually it gets destroyed.

Some evenings I come home from work with my heart so heavy.

Would you call this system "capitalism" and a fine example of competition in American?  I would not.  It is serfdom and servitude - these people are prisoners of the insurance policies selected by their employers. This is a horror inflicted upon the American people.

Excellent post, rebeccajo!

Excellent post, rebeccajo!

Indeed. It's good to see someone highlight the rationing that goes on in US healthcare on a daily basis... something that opponents of change would have us believe is the preserve of dastardly "socialized medicine".

Given all of our other problems at the moment and all the debt we're accumulating, this was not the time to introduce this.

Personally I'd say it's exactly the time to introduce it - couple it with the problems encountered by the car industry, one of the major problems that has made the US car industry uncompetitive is having to provide healthcare, remove that from companies and you make it cheaper to employ people!

I am a 'gatekeeper' for a health care facility.

I'm the admissions director at a geriatric rehab and skilled nursing hospital. My job is as much about making sure we can meet our patients' needs medically as it is about making sure our facility gets paid. We have contracts with the VA, Kaiser, Blue Cross, Medicare, Medical (medicaid), and a host of other insurance companies. I work with the various hospitals and insurance companies all day long, negotiating rates and fighting for care. I know how the system works, and I know it's broken. I also know the 'quality' of care that the VA provides versus the others and nothing would EVER convince me that government run healthcare is the way to go, not in this country.

I'm the admissions director at a geriatric rehab and skilled nursing hospital. My job is as much about making sure we can meet our patients' needs medically as it is about making sure our facility gets paid. We have contracts with the VA, Kaiser, Blue Cross, Medicare, Medical (medicaid), and a host of other insurance companies. I work with the various hospitals and insurance companies all day long, negotiating rates and fighting for care. I know how the system works, and I know it's broken. I also know the 'quality' of care that the VA provides versus the others and nothing would EVER convince me that government run healthcare is the way to go, not in this country.

The VA Hospitals in Clarksburg, WV and Pittsburgh, PA saved the husbands of two friends of mine from cancer.

I also know the 'quality' of care that the VA provides versus the others and nothing would EVER convince me that government run healthcare is the way to go, not in this country.

That might be a point if there was any consideration whatsoever of a government run health system a la VA and NHS. There isn't.