Who wants to be a British citizen???

Tholian, perhaps this is a very dumb or naive suggestion, but why doesn't your girlfriend hire you as an assistant?  Then you could get a work permit that would entitle you to travel with her, couldn't you?

That's just a "pulled out of my [nose]" idea...but isn't there some way to make that work?  And you could get around the "Isn't there an EU citizen who could do the job" by simply saying that she's comfortable with YOU.

The only downside I can see is that if you get in trouble with one government (or they want to question you or whatever), you cant seek protection from the other government. You can still run into the Embassy grounds and ask for protection from other civillians, but not from the police or government. But if youre an upstanding citizen and you keep your head down and your business to yourself there shouldnt be any reason for that to be a problematic downside

I am not yet sure if I will ever take up dual citizenship, but above is the thing that scares me about it.  What if I am in need and my nation turns its back on me?  Of course, I really like this take on it...if you are a law obiding citizen you won't run into that problem.

But here's the question I have:  Other than the right to vote, what bennifits are there to it if you already have a LTR?  Once you have that, you are good to stay...right?

Tholian, perhaps this is a very dumb or naive suggestion, but why doesn't your girlfriend hire you as an assistant?  Then you could get a work permit that would entitle you to travel with her, couldn't you?

That's just a "pulled out of my [nose]" idea...but isn't there some way to make that work?  And you could get around the "Isn't there an EU citizen who could do the job" by simply saying that she's comfortable with YOU.

We've been advised that my seeking a work permit in another EU country would not be smart while I am still on the 2-year probationary unmarried-partner visa--it might lead to the Home Office questioning my commitment to living in the UK when I apply for ILR next autumn, or it might mean that I would simply not be eligible for ILR or for citizenship later on, because of days out of the country and so forth.  Also, and it's sad to say, authorities are on the lookout for gay couples doing things EXACTLY like this in an attempt to circumvent immigration law.  I do not want to take the chance on doing anything that might give me a bad record here, in Germany or anywhere else. 

We've been advised that my seeking a work permit in another EU country would not be smart while I am still on the 2-year probationary unmarried-partner visa--it might lead to the Home Office questioning my commitment to living in the UK when I apply for ILR next autumn, or it might mean that I would simply not be eligible for ILR or for citizenship later on, because of days out of the country and so forth.  Also, and it's sad to say, authorities are on the lookout for gay couples doing things EXACTLY like this in an attempt to circumvent immigration law.  I do not want to take the chance on doing anything that might give me a bad record here, in Germany or anywhere else. 

Well, good to know that while it might be a dagerous idea, it wasn't a DUMB idea.     But sorry it wasn't helpful to you.

I am not yet sure if I will ever take up dual citizenship, but above is the thing that scares me about it.  What if I am in need and my nation turns its back on me?  Of course, I really like this take on it...if you are a law obiding citizen you won't run into that problem.

But here's the question I have:  Other than the right to vote, what bennifits are there to it if you already have a LTR?  Once you have that, you are good to stay...right?

If you have Indefinite Leave to Remain, then leave the UK to live elsewhere, if you are gone for longer than 2 years, you must reapply for entry.  If you have a British Passport, you simply "return home" no matter how long the absence.

Plus, I would say that the right to vote is a big one - I live here, my children are being raised here; I should have some say in what goes on politically.

For me - the UK is my home more than the US ever was.  Securing British citizenship will just make my relationship with the UK "legal" - just like my marriage to my husband.  I wouldn't love him any less if we weren't married, but being so just show the level of committment.

Frances, you asked about 'nation turning its back on you"... In the literature I read, I seem to recall something about entering the country with whichever passport is the country that "supports" you. In other words, if you enter the UK with a British passport, you are supported by British law. And the other way around. This is why I enter the US with my American passport and enter the UK with my British passport. (Same with leaving, leave the UK with the British, leave the US with the American.)

In this way, you have support from the government of the country you are in, plus the benefits of the Embassy of the country you hold a passport for.

That's my understanding. Anyone know for sure?

This is what it says in my husband's British passport:

"British nationals who are also nationals of another country cannot be protected by Her Majesty's Representatives against the authorities of that country."

I would assume the same would hold true for US nationals?  Dunno.....

But here's the question I have:  Other than the right to vote, what bennifits are there to it if you already have a LTR?  Once you have that, you are good to stay...right?

I think the right to live/work in other EU countries without a visa is a pretty big benefit - we're not planning on leaving England anytime soon, but we have definitely thought of going to Italy to retire or perhaps to work short-term just before we retire.

As for the LTR, the only real drag to that that I can see is that whenever your US passport expires, you have to go through the whole application process again (and while you obviously will get a new visa easily, you do have to go through the hassle and apparently have to pay again) - at least that is what a friend of mine was told when she rececived LTR recently. Though I suppose that's just a very rare hassle more than a disadvantage. Although I will say that even though this friend of mine has LTR, she still gets questioned a lot in immigration and customs ("how did you get it" lines of questioning) and to be honest I'm sort of sick of that whole thing - to be able to just breeze through immigration in the same line as Jamie sounds like heaven! 

As for the LTR, the only real drag to that that I can see is that whenever your US passport expires, you have to go through the whole application process again (and while you obviously will get a new visa easily, you do have to go through the hassle and apparently have to pay again) - at least that is what a friend of mine was told when she rececived LTR recently.

Once you have ILR, it's indefinite.  You don't have to apply again.  Once your US passport expires, you get a new one and you'll just have to carry around your old passport so you can show the ILR stamp.  There's no need to go through the process (or payment..ugh!) again.

Dear Tholian,

I seem to be living in some universe parallel to yours, as so many of your problems are similar to ones I have gone through already.

I would not do anything to upset my ILR application, if I were you. You also have to have intent to remain in the UK, if you wish to naturalise, unless the UK has now harmonised its rule on unmarried partner to bring it into line with the regular married spousal kind (my understanding is that it has not, but check with a solicitor).

You could get residence in Germany, but to leave now would shoot your ILR all to h***. You would have to start over from square one. And even if you left after you received it, the immigration service is twitchy about people with ILR living abroad. I personally met a woman in Washington DC whose ILR was cancelled (!) because she was studying in the US and couldn't satisfy the officer that she was not returning to resume her residence! Citizenship avoids all these hassles.

By the way: The Germans require 8 years legal residence to grant naturalisation, and they DO NOT permit dual nationality. You would absolutely have to give up the US passport to get a German one.

Silly question, your solicitor has probably asked this, but do you have any familial connection with any of the EU member states that could conceivably entitle you to an EU passport? A friend of a friend of mine just got an Italian passaporto on the strength of his Sicilian grandfather...

misch:  I did look at the nationality route a couple of years ago, and it's not possible.  My great-grandmother was from England, but that doesn't meet UK ancestry requirements.  And another great-grandfather AND great-grandmother came to the US from Germany, and I can prove that...but although Germany does permit "right of return" applications going back to the great-grandparents, it only applies ON THE FATHER'S SIDE of the family.  And unfortunately for me, it's my MOTHER'S grandparents who happened to be from Wiesbaden.

My father's family, I'm afraid, were a motley crew of Russian, German and English Jews all of whose families had been in America for quite a while.  So no help there.  I can't even become Israeli because my mother is not Jewish hence I am not either!  <laughs wryly>

You are right; as of yet, the UK has not brought gay partners' immigration into line with hetero spousal requirements.  The gay-partnership bill was supposed to do that, but (as you probably know) has been gutted in the Lords and now has only a questionable chance of passing, and even if it does, will probably not come into full effect in time for me to avoid jumping through the hoops. 

The only thing for it, is to wait and get the UK passport.  I hate to be separated from my gf, and she hates it too, but we do what we must.  Even in the worst case scenario, me living in London while she lives in Berlin is preferable to me living in Philly while she lives in Europe...which is what we had before.  She is not completely thrilled with the contract provisions anyway, and chances are that she will accept it only partly because of other considerations besides me...but still, there's that nagging feeling..."is she farking up her career because of me?  Can I live with that?"  I mean, I gave up my entire career for her, but that doesn't mean I think she should do the same or anything even close.

I go back and forth between feeling grateful that we are allowed to be together at all, ever, and feeling very angry that we should have to go through pain like this in the first place.  I think it is very wrong.

What does your solicitor say about the two of you not residing in the same physical place prior to your obtaining ILR?

You're able to visit Germany, right? Or are too many trips considered verboten?
I agree, your gf shouldn't jeopardize her career. (When my brother's wife died he pypassed a promotion, from Lt. Col. to Col. in the Army, to spend more time with his sons. When it came time that he was ready to climb again, he knew he'd committed political suicide by holding back and everything fell apart. He retired early with a smaller pension and he's miserable. I don't for any reason feel he made the wrong choice. It's just that's what happened with his job.)

*hugs* sounds like you've investigated everything. I know I can't change the laws, but I can vote. 

What does your solicitor say about the two of you not residing in the same physical place prior to your obtaining ILR?

That's actually not a problem, for two reasons:

1.  Because she is a freelance performing artist who works as an independent contractor (regardless of the length of contract), as long as the UK is her home for tax purposes, then it's also her home and her primary address for immigration purposes.  The government cannot have it both ways...they can't say she lives here when it's time to assess her taxes, but not when it's time to give me ILR.

2.  Because her profession necessarily requires a great deal of foreign travel, if it comes to this we can argue that the HO would be wrong to expect my gf not to be traveling.  That would be an unreasonable restraint on her freedom to pursue the career of her choice.  It's no problem to show that extended periods abroad are the rule, rather than the exception, for successful opera singers.  We would only have to do this on appeal but I don't expect it to go that far, honestly.

LisaE:  Yes, I can visit Germany, but of course I'm limited to a total of 90 days in any one year, and too-frequent entries will raise the eyebrows of German immigration police.  As I said, chances are that my partner will end up taking only the roles that she wants and declining the ones which don't interest her.  She is past the "dues paying" stage, so she's not going to mess up her career by doing that.  Chances are that she'll go away for 3 to 6 weeks at a time.  Chances are also good that if I need it, I can get a letter from someone over there explaining why I am visiting so frequently and that I have no intention of settling in Germany.

Tholian,

A weekend relationship is a bummer, but it is better than being stuck in the US and seeing each other only after taking a long-haul flight!

I have done all the above and that is the reason for what I was saying about the parallel universe.

Weekends are actually rather nice because you tend to focus only on being together and doing things, rather than all the day to day boring drivel.

And you will eventually get British citizenship. So hold tight, I would say!

Are you working in the UK?