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Topic: UK: Meddling with the English language again  (Read 7417 times)

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Re: UK: Meddling with the English language again
« Reply #15 on: October 28, 2009, 01:47:53 PM »
I still don't see a problem with most of it.

How about misinformation as to what words actually mean?   How is that going to be sensitive to the majority who do actually understand the proper meaning?

And the ridiculous "PC" garbage which they're still clearly trying to perpetuate, like this?

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The same guide also warns against the phrases 'manning the phones', 'layman's terms' and 'the tax man', for 'making women invisible'.

And how about this part?

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Following a Freedom of Information request to police forces and fire services it also emerged that a number, including Essex Police and Northern Ireland Fire and Rescue Service, instruct staff to avoid the words 'child, youth or youngster'.

They could have 'connotations of inexperience, impetuosity and unreliability, or even dishonesty'.

Well, of course child has connotations of inexperience.  By the time a person has lived long enough to gain experience, he is no longer a child.   That's a fact of the life that they're not going to change by idiotic diktats about what words to use.   And how do they figure "even dishonesty?"    Why on earth would anyone automatically think that a word like child or youngster has connotations of dishonesty? 

The guidelines then seem to shoot themselves in the foot:

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The guide used by them also states that addressing someone as 'boy' or 'girl' may 'cause offence'. It suggests 'young people' instead.

So youngster or youth is to be avoided because it might have negative connotations, but "young people" is a preferred term.    [smiley=mad.gif]

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Re: UK: Meddling with the English language again
« Reply #16 on: October 28, 2009, 02:06:22 PM »
And changing "manhole cover" to "personnel access hatch" FFS ::) LOL



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Re: UK: Meddling with the English language again
« Reply #17 on: October 28, 2009, 02:14:33 PM »
"personnel access hatch"

But personnel contains the word son, which clearly indicates male bias, so anyone who dares to use the word must clearly be a male chauvinist. 

And hatch?  Isn't that what chickens do?  Are you calling me a chicken?  How dare you!   :P   ;D

The buffoons who for the last two decades have been complaining about perfectly normal words like manhole or mankind are just demonstrating their own ignorance of the English language.  (Oops, demonstrating contains the word demon.  I do hope you won't take offense and think that was directed at you......)

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Re: UK: Meddling with the English language again
« Reply #18 on: October 28, 2009, 02:21:42 PM »
Offense contains the word "off". And that means.... erm... gimme a minute, I'm sure I should be indignant about something!


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Re: UK: Meddling with the English language again
« Reply #19 on: October 28, 2009, 10:26:47 PM »
Yawn.


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Re: UK: Meddling with the English language again
« Reply #20 on: October 28, 2009, 11:43:54 PM »
Yawn.

I take it that means you don't have any logical arguments against my points above then.
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Re: UK: Meddling with the English language again
« Reply #21 on: October 29, 2009, 07:04:51 AM »
I take it that means you don't have any logical arguments against my points above then.


No, I have plenty but I can't really be bothered arguing the point I've argued so many times before. It's a bit pointless really, having discussions like this with people who aren't really interested in another point of view.  But seriously, Paul, getting constantly angry about whether people use a word like 'manhole' can't be good for your blood pressure! I mean, if you;re all for free speech, then it shouldn't bother you if someone says 'man hole' or 'sanitation cover' or whatever - it's their right to do so.


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Re: UK: Meddling with the English language again
« Reply #22 on: October 29, 2009, 08:44:02 AM »
I take it that means you don't have any logical arguments against my points above then.

No, I have plenty but I can't really be bothered arguing the point I've argued so many times before. It's a bit pointless really, having discussions like this with people who aren't really interested in another point of view. 

Precisely.  I enjoy discussing politics and society on this board, but whenever you post, Paul, I already know what to expect: a link to a story from The Daily Mail with a biased report on some government policy followed by a mild to moderate rant about the incompetence or greed of the government.

It doesn't matter whether the issue is an important one (improper use of surveillance laws) or a stupid one (EU light bulb regulations), and it doesn't matter how many people respond with other points of view to show that the Mail's reporting has spun an issue in a misleading manner, you stick to what the Mail says, never budging an inch, always seeing a world of pure black and white, where everyone is either good or evil.

So like Shahbanou, I'm having a hard time seeing the point of posting responses to your threads.


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Re: UK: Meddling with the English language again
« Reply #23 on: October 30, 2009, 05:36:39 PM »
How exactly is the Daily Mail supposed to be "spinning" the reports in this case?

They're quoting the language advice given in publications for the police, fire service, etc.  So are you saying they've just made it all up?   That that advice has not been issued?   

For the record, I recognize that there are times when the reporters clearly make a complete hash of writing headlines and summaries, such as this recent story:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1223307/Plane-madness-Schoolboy-TV-aerial-confiscated-Government-officials-interfering-aircraft-signals.html]

But when they're quoting directly from publications, how is the story wrong?  Maybe you or I disagree with the way the story is presented, maybe you or I might think the angle is suggesting something more serious than the facts indicate, but in the case, unless you are questioning the facts of the advice given to these departments, the underlying issues remain the same.

But seriously, Paul, getting constantly angry about whether people use a word like 'manhole' can't be good for your blood pressure! I mean, if you;re all for free speech, then it shouldn't bother you if someone says 'man hole' or 'sanitation cover' or whatever - it's their right to do so.

In case you'd forgotten, it's supporters of the "PC" nonsense who are the ones who want people to stop using manhole, black mark, or other phrases.
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Re: UK: Meddling with the English language again
« Reply #24 on: October 30, 2009, 05:42:13 PM »

In case you'd forgotten, it's supporters of the "PC" nonsense who are the ones who want people to stop using manhole, black mark, or other phrases.


I think Shahbanou was commenting on your getting worked up about the fact that certain people want to get rid of the phrases rather than that people are using them.


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Re: UK: Meddling with the English language again
« Reply #25 on: October 30, 2009, 05:57:43 PM »
In case you'd forgotten, it's supporters of the "PC" nonsense who are the ones who want people to stop using manhole, black mark, or other phrases.

How is insisting people should use the "traditional" language any better then? Still seems like a restriction on a person's speech to me.  Really, if you're that worried about restrictions on people's freedom of speech and government surveillance, read this, and then tell me people in the UK seriously have something to fear. Seems to me the greater threat is from big business.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8112550.stm








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Re: UK: Meddling with the English language again
« Reply #26 on: October 30, 2009, 09:10:30 PM »
How exactly is the Daily Mail supposed to be "spinning" the reports in this case?

They're quoting the language advice given in publications for the police, fire service, etc.  So are you saying they've just made it all up?   That that advice has not been issued?   

Just as many people on this thread have responded to say that they think training police officers in how to interact with members of the public is a good idea, The Mail could've reported this by saying, "The government has made an admirable effort to lower tention between the police and the community by training officers in community relations."

But they went with the "PC nonsense" angle instead.  That's spin.  They're reporting facts, but in such a way as to support the political slant of the article.


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Re: UK: Meddling with the English language again
« Reply #27 on: October 30, 2009, 09:24:54 PM »
I'm confused. Are we commenting on the Daily Mail's spin on the story, or the actual story?



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Re: UK: Meddling with the English language again
« Reply #28 on: October 30, 2009, 09:35:01 PM »
I'm confused. Are we commenting on the Daily Mail's spin on the story, or the actual story?

We're commenting on the idea that the subject of the Mail story can be reported in a number of different ways, not all of which would support the Mail's conclusion.


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Re: UK: Meddling with the English language again
« Reply #29 on: October 31, 2009, 02:31:22 AM »
I'm confused. Are we commenting on the Daily Mail's spin on the story, or the actual story?



It's predictable how it turns into a 'bash the Mail-a-thon' here versus actually discussing/debating a story. If the story is true, it's true regarless of if we agree/disagree with the tone of writing.

Personally, I feel that PC nonsense is ridiculous and taken to extremes.   
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