Self defense and right to bear arms in UK

Ok so you oppose the idea of firearms for self defence, any thoughts on non lethal alternatives? surely you recognize a use for them in a big urban area

My father always kept a baseball bat in his house - as well as keeping a iron pipe in the van he drove as well - and no one messed with him or the house. Hes been there since 1974 and its the only house in the area not to be burglarized.

We were broken into once in March 2010 (we were in the house as well), but think its the jackasses kids who live behind us. 3 weeks after it all happened, everything except my phone came back to me (even my 3rd gen iPod w/ £100 headphones) as the bag was 'found' in their ivy (which I actually think they meant under their kids bed) We've now installed an alarm, and the door beeps very loudly each and every time its opened. We also plan on installing a motion detector at our back door as well.

Our postcode is one of the highest in the country for break ins (though its a really nice and desirable area) but its because we're surrounded by some dodgy areas, as well as being working middle class (ie: people here have some nice things like a big tvs, stereos, a car, etc)

Guns freak me out!  I felt so scared when we approached a guard near Kensington Palace for directions (heh).  He had some assault rifle, and I don't ever think I saw a guard of any sort (this guard, of course, was military).  I felt a bit shaken by it.  I guess I never felt that way seeing hunting rifles in gun racks, but seeing someone with one in his hands (and it being such a menacing thing) was something different.

I was in Manhattan a few days after 9/11 and seeing armed military police in Penn Station creeped the hell out of me. I remember trying to hold back the tears from the shock of that as I headed downtown (though not near Ground Zero)

NoseOverTail- I walk down the street with my keys in my hand if I feel uncomfortable too. My mom taught me how to do that when I was much younger "Cut them across the forehead! No one can remember what they were about to do when they are bleeding into their eyes!"

This. When my friend was mugged a few years back, he used his house keys as defense. Was able to keep two of the three off him. The third one sucker punched him to the ground.. The police were able to identify and arrest them because of the distinct scratches/cuts James left on those shitheads.

I would also recommend a barky dog. My MILs house was almost broken into once, but the teeny little, but incredibly LOUD, jack russells barking scared off the intruders. They know this because the attempted burgulars broke the window, but didnt get in.

In some parts yes, especially NYC, only reason NYC is safer than other big cities is because its like a police state with NYPD on every corner

Describing NYC  as a police state is a little much. The reason there are police all over the place in midtown is to give tourists directions and make them feel safe. I used to live in Bed-Stuy and I assure you there were not cops everywhere. And also, I almost always felt safe there, even coming home at 4 am when I worked as a waitress.

Hollyberry, the man who assaulted me did the same thing the boy on the bike did to you. He swerved his bike and just hit me. Thank goodness he didn't harm you!

Thank you for this, and I'm sorry that you weren't as fortunate as I was.  It really came out of nowhere.  I hope you are healing up OK!

I was in Manhattan a few days after 9/11 and seeing armed military police in Penn Station creeped the hell out of me. I remember trying to hold back the tears from the shock of that as I headed downtown (though not near Ground Zero)

When I landed by boat in NY I was shocked to see armed policeman. I knew ahead of time they were armed but seeing the real thing bothered me. Years later I was visiting the UK and of course the police were not armed except..at the airport the police were walking around with rifles and they had their fingers on the trigger of the rifles.

When I landed by boat in NY I was shocked to see armed policeman. I knew ahead of time they were armed but seeing the real thing bothered me. Years later I was visiting the UK and of course the police were not armed except..at the airport the police were walking around with rifles and they had their fingers on the trigger of the rifles.

Yeah, it was actually seeing a gun and/or rifle. I was used to NYPD hanging around the entrance of Penn, but they ever had their hands on their weapons....

except..at the airport the police were walking around with rifles and they had their fingers on the trigger of the rifles.

On the trigger, or across the trigger guard? The way you're normally trained is to keep your finger straight, resting on the front of the trigger guard. That way it's in position if you need to shoot, but at the same time it isn't going to accidentally pull the trigger if you trip and fall or something.
Finger actually on the trigger is bad drills unless you're actually about to shoot someone.

Describing NYC  as a police state is a little much. The reason there are police all over the place in midtown is to give tourists directions and make them feel safe. I used to live in Bed-Stuy and I assure you there were not cops everywhere. And also, I almost always felt safe there, even coming home at 4 am when I worked as a waitress.

Well yes tourism is a big reason for the authorities to keep NYC safe, but you can't compare a place like NYC to Detroit or Baltimore, as I'm guessing that both Detroit and Baltimore have less of a police presence mainly because of lack of tourism

Well yes tourism is a big reason for the authorities to keep NYC safe, but you can't compare a place like NYC to Detroit or Baltimore, as I'm guessing that both Detroit and Baltimore have less of a police presence mainly because of lack of tourism

I'm saying that in the non-super touristy areas of Manhattan and all of the outer boroughs, there are a lot less cops. Those areas are still pretty safe. And even in the touristy areas of Manhattan "police on every corner" is a) an exaggeration b) implying they're running some kind of check point instead of shooting the sh*t with each other/eating donuts/occasionally pointing a tourist in the direction of the Wicked theater.

Yeah , I don't think the gun control is a factor in it being safe else Chicago, Newark and LA would be less dangerous, maybe it works to some degree in the UK as gangs find it harder to acquire weapons but then again they're still going to stab, bludgeon or hit and run their targets, and a murder is just as tragic no matter what is used

I'm sorry but I find it hard to take the "pepper sprays are dangerous too" argument seriously when you have knives readily available and thugs eager to use them, knife to the face or mace to the face? I think I'd choose the mace

My point was that, whichever you take in the face, it's enough to incapacitate you.

The bottom line is that the best self-defense is awareness and common sense.

I think we could all site an infinite number of sources and quotes as to why gun control is a very smart move for any country. Apparently the OP has not done his research as he seems to enjoy nothing more than attempting to cause controversy on this board. Had he done his research he would know:

Virginia:

Handgun licenses will be issued to green-card holders, not other aliens. See Code of Virginia Section 18.2-308.

Perhaps he should attend an NRA singles meet and learn that many of those Republican Conservatives despise immigrants almost as much any form of gun control.

Even though I do like maybe 2 things he has to say, Ron Paul, would rather spit in his face than grant him a green card or citizenship. This seems to be a problem with many conservatives. One or two phrases excite them beyond belief and they bite the hand that feeds them.

To the OP: I believe that we are all entitled to our own beliefs. If you really want to come to the US just because at some point you will be allowed a weapon then do it. You also need to keep in mind that you will need a job with health care benefits as hospitals and doctors will turn you away without a second thought. People in the US regularly declare bankruptcy due to medical bills. "Oh you can't afford to pay for your operation we will auction off your house whether you still live in it or not." That is just one slight tangent as to how the UK is superior, but as I stated....to each their own.  

I would just ask that you quit coming here trying to stir up controversy. As you have (or should have) learned from your previous experiences you will not gain much sympathy here. The reason you do not hear "Libertarians, Republicans, conservatives" speak up in your defense is because those people rarely immigrate because they feel that America is #1 at any and everything and therefore they rarely move from the country.

Please send money to Ron/Newt/Mittens and see how much easier it will be for you to immigrate!

Many "Libertarians" where I live are nothing but embarrassed Republicans.  After Obama was elected, the number of newly-minted "Libertarians" here went up considerably.  This has not modified voting patterns in the least, despite the fact that Libertarians do run for office.  Many of these will also call themselves "constitutionalists."  They want to take this country back, way back, to the Constitution as it was originally written.  By the way, this means a lot less rights for immigrants.  

Say something that they perceive as even the slightest bit negative about the US, and they will tell you to get your @%!^$^%$#%^$% immigrant whatever back to where you came from.  Some will even offer assistance.

Should you choose to run in these circles, be prepared to get evangelical Christianity shoved down your throat.  Many of these people are dominionists; they sincerely believe that God wants only Christians to hold public office.    

As for Montana, I've got a nephew who lives there.  He likes it, but says he steers clear of the militias.  There are areas of that state with a fair amount of that activity.  He has worked and lived near them, but wants no part of them---good idea.    

Even in states where the gun laws are more liberal, one can still lose the right to own or possess one.  

A gun owner is also accountable for every round he or she fires, including the rounds that may go through a neighbor's home or hit an innocent passerby.  I was told that by a police officer who investigated an attempted home invasion (my home).  I scared him off shouting, but had my gun at the ready.

I've also had a window broken when I was fast asleep.  If my neighbors hadn't heard it, I don't know if I could have gotten to my gun in time, and been alert enough to use it properly.  A gun is not the be-all, end-all of self-defense.  Even with a concealed-carry permit, there are still places where it is illegal to carry a gun.  In such places, a viable alternative to firearms is required should self-defense be needed.  A concealed-carry permit can also be revoked.      

I do wonder if the OP's eagerness to own a gun has to do with his recent encounter with an assailant.  I would recommend some sort of self-defense lessons a.s.a.p., like Model Mugger, krav maga, etc.  Even if he does move to the US, it won't be next week, and it may build some confidence in the meantime.        

I do wonder if the OP's eagerness to own a gun has to do with his recent encounter with an assailant.  I would recommend some sort of self-defense lessons a.s.a.p., like Model Mugger, krav maga, etc.  Even if he does move to the US, it won't be next week, and it may build some confidence in the meantime.        

No not at all, I'm not that fussed about carrying anything where I live, but if I was living in London or somewhere I'd definitely want to. The other point I'm trying to casually make is that people should choose how they want to protect themselves and in this country you have to make a very steep compromise, and krav maga lessons cost money, a lot more than a can of pepper spray

No not at all, I'm not that fussed about carrying anything where I live, but if I was living in London or somewhere I'd definitely want to. The other point I'm trying to casually make is that people should choose how they want to protect themselves and in this country you have to make a very steep compromise, and krav maga lessons cost money, a lot more than a can of pepper spray

Though, the lessons taught stay with you FORVEVER.

London isnt as dangerous as you're making it out to be.

Also, from a police friend, UK pepper spray is much weaker than what is used in the States, but still hurts like a MoFo. All police have to be tazered, pepper sprayed, etc before they complete their training. Even the police are told to use the pepper spray they carry on them that with great caution.

Your house keys work as a GREAT weapon. Especially those old school type keys that most people use here.
http://www.ehow.com/video_4429660_use-keys-as-weapons-womens.html

Some jurisdictions in the US require police and private security to be Tasered or pepper sprayed before carrying them.  I think it should be universal, including for people who want to carry them in areas where private ownership of Tasers is legal.  I bet there wouldn't be many who'd apply for them if that was a requirement.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taser_controversy#Deaths_and_injuries_related_to_Taser_use

I'm not anti-gun, but I'd never want to carry one on my person.  I'm small and relatively weak and without some serious self defense training, I'd bet it could be taken from me in a second.  Nevermind the issues already mentioned about gun training and the effects of stress on accuracy. 

The only time I've been genuinely afraid in the UK was after a robbery and my husband was out of town.  Our building had been scaffolded for weeks and I was very clearly watched and targeted.  I was pregnant at the time, and had the robber not bolted my door from the inside, after climbing in a window, I would have walked in while they were still there.  Id been robbed back in the US, but we were in a university area and so it seemed less personal -- every apartment was sure to have good electronics around there.