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Topic: The Conversation: Black Wednesday for New Doctors  (Read 1436 times)

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The Conversation: Black Wednesday for New Doctors
« on: September 11, 2013, 12:53:57 PM »
Does anyone know if this happens in a similar way in the US?  I doubt it, but makes me never want to get sick in August!!!

http://theconversation.com/happy-black-wednesday-every-doctors-nightmare-16106
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Re: The Conversation: Black Wednesday for New Doctors
« Reply #1 on: September 11, 2013, 01:22:44 PM »
Oh yes...I've worked for many years in teaching hospitals.  The new baby doctors start in July & it's a total cluster F.  God love 'em, they have to learn somehow, but the combination of them adjusting to their new level of responsibility + the logistics of writing/entering orders....it ain't pretty. 
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Re: The Conversation: Black Wednesday for New Doctors
« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2013, 01:28:30 PM »
Does anyone know if this happens in a similar way in the US?  I doubt it, but makes me never want to get sick in August!!!



Well the article does state the "July phenomenon"  in the US
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Re: The Conversation: Black Wednesday for New Doctors
« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2013, 01:41:04 PM »
It does, but doctors seem to move around a lot more in the US because there is no national "system" as it were, so hospitals could so as they please really. It seems it shouldn't happen if you can stagger out your newbs...



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Re: The Conversation: Black Wednesday for New Doctors
« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2013, 04:58:28 PM »
I recall learning this at a very young age - maybe from the Cherry Ames, Student Nurse series of books?
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Re: The Conversation: Black Wednesday for New Doctors
« Reply #5 on: September 12, 2013, 10:54:00 AM »
I think it's interesting... I'm of the opinion it may be more because junior doctors move to their next year of rotation to foundation year 2 - and often to new hospitals-  I would think that the first days for freshly graduated doctors- they're more likely to ask questions every step of the way -when they're F2s, they're supposed to "know more" and are less likely to ask questions, even when in a new hospital?  

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It may be countered that newly minted doctors will be more hesitant, more cautious, and more willing to ask for help than doctors with a few months of experience under their belts. In response I would agree that doctors with a bit of experience might become too blasé and that Alexander Pope was right to warn us that “a little learning is a dangerous thing”.

and
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. Under the current system, somewhat incredibly, senior doctors often move to new jobs in the same month or week (or, even more astonishingly, on the same day) that junior doctors start work for the first time.


I correlate this to our graduate engineers who do two year rotations through our company-  Their first 6 months, they're asking tons and tons and tons of questions, by the next 6 months, they've moved onto to something new but are still ok asking some questions -but their third rotation, they think they know it all, even though its a completely new area. We often get a lot of mistakes made on the graduate engineers third rotations.  (Thinking back to my second year of a 'proper job' I am sure I made some right cockups!!!) Maybe not as immediate as killing someone - but working in medical devices, their screw up can have a huge impact to a  patient down the line!  

That said, we all have to start somewhere and learn as we go!!! It's unfortunate for the junior doctors their screw ups mean lives are at stake.......

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Re: The Conversation: Black Wednesday for New Doctors
« Reply #6 on: September 12, 2013, 10:54:25 PM »
The problem is that in the interests of "fairness" recruiting for doctors in the UK is increasingly done on a national basis until you are consultant (=attending) level. That means that even if you have studied in a hospital for 6 years, and done your junior years there, you still have exactly the same chance of getting a senior post in that hospital as someone who is from the other end of the country (as long as you have the same qualifications and test scores). For some specialties, there is no interview to be appointed any longer, only an exam and a portfolio aka reflective diary.


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