Which country to retire to for fun, culture, nightlife? Ireland,France, Spain?

Even in the States... when I was traveling cross-country in the mid-1960s every area had its own regional flavor. The way a burger was made, the dialects, the stores, what people wore, etc. Made a similar trip in the mid-2000s and so much had changed. The interstates, for one, zipped us by the smaller towns (whereas the old highway system used to take us through them). The same chain restaurants were everywhere, the kids all looked the same, the clothes were the same, a lot of the really thick accents were not really there (except in older people). The music was the same. The TV in the motels was the same and there was a clone mall in every larger town. We saw new buildings going up that had the same architecture as SoCalif strip malls and apartments. It was, actually, kind of sad. (The move from a local culture to a national one. Although it is nice that some of each culture is now in the mainstream.)

But it was/is inevitable. It will be more inevitable as populations increase, the media saturates and permeates, and people move around more. And they will move. Europeans rode amazingly tiny boats to North America.  In the Dust Bowl years of the 1930s in the USA people in the mid-west moved West (and were unwelcome) and rural types moved to the cities. Desperate people are now ~walking~ to the USA from South and Central America.  As a rule, people go where they think they have a chance of a better life, rather than stay where the land (or weather/economy/politics/crime/neighbors/institutions) will try to kill them or keep them at barely subsistence levels.

Nobody can stop that kind of migration, unless they can ameliorate the cause(s). And I don't see that happening - there is, apparently, no will to do so. I can't see how it won't be just as in the States - people will come to Europe as long as the Middle-East is in turmoil and people are starving in Africa. The EU is going to have to sort out how to handle it. And when the EU hits capacity, it'll spill over to non-EU. Like a somewhat perverse version of Sim City.  One can erect fences, but eventually the weight of bodies against the chainlink will break them down and it'll be a flood. Better to deal with it incrementially, I think.

It's the speed of the change that makes people uncomfortable. A nice steady change that lets people get used to the changes works. If the change is too fast, people just don't cope very well and will resist. I think the EU was just trying to do too much too quickly.....and then with something like the big increase with immigrants/refugees coming up from the south they just couldn't get their act together to come up with a good response when it mattered.

I have to say... It's only certain generations who feel that the change is 'too quick'...

Their population structure can't invite in 30 million people without changing that nation's culture forever.

Nobody has invited 30 million people in. There is no such thing as an open door policy.

The founding principle of the what is now the EU is very simple, you get along with people better if you trade with them. That is the teleological basis.

It follows that trade cannot function correctly when work forces are made static.

And the thing is, it has worked.  If we take the collapse of the Soviet Union for instance, it was a perfect incubator for regional war. With a few exceptions, by bringing them into the structures of the EU, we avoided, for the most part, the kind of thing that has happened with regularity here -  mass war. Free movement is a sign of success.

I have to say... It's only certain generations who feel that the change is 'too quick'...

Yep.....it's almost always older people who can't make the easy changes (in my opinion). Younger people always want things to change quickly.......until they get older and they become what they couldn't stand when they were younger (although they can't usually see it at that point). Things keep changing.....which is a good thing. Never fast enough when you are young......too fast when you are old.

Nobody has invited 30 million people in. There is no such thing as an open door policy.

The founding principle of the what is now the EU is very simple, you get along with people better if you trade with them. That is the teleological basis.

It follows that trade cannot function correctly when work forces are made static.

And the thing is, it has worked.  If we take the collapse of the Soviet Union for instance, it was a perfect incubator for regional war. With a few exceptions, by bringing them into the structures of the EU, we avoided, for the most part, the kind of thing that has happened with regularity here -  mass war. Free movement is a sign of success.

But what do you say to those Brits that feel overwhelmed by the large number of EU citizens that have the right to live in the UK? Maybe not 10 million will come but the number who have the right to come is huge. When they come to the UK they will not leave behind their culture.  And why would a person stay put in Poland or Hungary ect,  when life can be so much better in the UK?

 If and when the economy collapse in their birth nation based on EU rules they are allowed to move to the UK and compete for jobs that Brits will need. In the opinion of many Brits that is a bridge too far. Many Brits have lived and died for their country so why should someone new to the country have the right to take an opportunity away from their kid after so much sacrifice over the generations. That is what it comes down to. Who has skin in the game.

Many Brits have lived and died for their country so why should someone new to the country have the right to take an opportunity away from their kid after so much sacrifice over the generations.

Starship Troopers territory here.

No one at all is suggesting any Englishman give up his culture.  Get St. George's cross tattooed on your forehead. No one will stop you. Drink tea. Speak English, it is and always will be the official language. Drive on the left.

Where is English culture being erased? Churches are closing because people just don't want to go anymore.

Starship Troopers territory here.

No one at all is suggesting any Englishman give up his culture.  Get St. George's cross tattooed on your forehead. No one will stop you. Drink tea. Speak English, it is and always will be the official language. Drive on the left.

Where is English culture being erased? Churches are closing because people just don't want to go anymore.

I don't really get this point of view. What "was" is always getting erased...some people deal with it, some have trouble. Not so much "erased" as diluted. In another 50 years or so....there probably won't be a very strong area dialect in the UK.......what was a strong accent for each area of the UK is slowly being diluted because it is easier to move around .....and will continue to do so. It isn't "wrong".....it's just the way of change.

In my opinion.....churches are losing people because of the ease of information(just a part of change....). People don't have to just take the word of religious folks anymore....they can check to see more information on their own.....and they aren't liking what they see. My opinion offends a lot of people....but organized religion is the worst thing that has ever happened in the history of civilization.  https://www.quora.com/Which-religion-is-responsible-for-the-greatest-number-of-deaths-of-infidels-over-its-entire-history

There are 36 million people in Poland, and only about 900,000 Polish people live in the UK. There are about 10 million people in Hungary, and only about 48,000 Hungarians live in the UK.

And why would a person stay put in Poland or Hungary ect,  when life can be so much better in the UK?

Their families are there? Their way of life is there? They like it? There are a lot of other considerations besides "I can make more money" when it comes to deciding where to live.

And why would a person stay put in Poland or Hungary ect,  when life can be so much better in the UK?

The ignorance of this statement astounds me.  The grass is not greener on the other side.

Have you spent any time in Poland or Hungary to be making such a bold statement?

The ignorance of this statement astounds me.  The grass is not greener on the other side.

Have you spent any time in Poland or Hungary to be making such a bold statement?

I'm not saying this is right or wrong.....but give me some facts that I'm not aware of (zillions of them normally). Life is better in Poland and Hungary because..........

I quite like those two countries....I think they are beautiful. I think if things start to go better for them, they could really be an up and coming area to go to...if they aren't already.

I'm not saying this is right or wrong.....but give me some facts that I'm not aware of (zillions of them normally). Life is better in Poland and Hungary because..........

I quite like those two countries....I think they are beautiful. I think if things start to go better for them, they could really be an up and coming area to go to...if they aren't already.

Most people I’ve met around the world have quite a strong sense of patriotism.  I’ve spent long stretches of time in third world countries and people are happy.  They are not looking to leave.  Not looking for greener pastures, but planting their roots and blooming where they are.

Why leave a country where your family, friends, and loved ones are?  Why come to the UK, which is so anti-immigration and you’ll feel like a dirty intruder at every turn simply because you don’t speak the Queen’s English?  Why leave everything you know and love?  For what?

Most people I’ve met around the world have quite a strong sense of patriotism.  I’ve spent long stretches of time in third world countries and people are happy.  They are not looking to leave.  Not looking for greener pastures, but planting their roots and blooming where they are.

Why leave a country where your family, friends, and loved ones are?  Why come to the UK, which is so anti-immigration and you’ll feel like a dirty intruder at every turn simply because you don’t speak the Queen’s English?  Why leave everything you know and love?  For what?

There are an absolute ton of Polish folks in Harrogate. Why? Did they just fall out of Poland and into the UK. Nope. There are building jobs in Harrogate. My wife worked at a local primary school.....lots of Polish kids were coming in. When You walk in town....lots of Polish being spoken. I'm not condemning....it's just what it is. They seem pretty decent people.

 I am signing off from commenting on this site....just way too many people who are convinced that they know what is going on....and "they understand" and others don't... other people who they don't agree with are "ignorant". I'll stick to the visa and tax sections...

I am signing off from commenting on this site....just way too many people who are convinced that they know what is going on....and "they understand" and others don't...

Three hours earlier:

...organized religion is the worst thing that has ever happened in the history of civilization. 

Yeah, Fred, you're open-minded, it's everyone else who is intolerant.

If you are hearing a lot of Polish, why not learn a few phrases. I study Spanish on the side as I may end up back in the US and Spanish has become almost a second official language.

It's the second time he's said that...