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Topic: Should we stay or go, fear of moving back to the UK!  (Read 4375 times)

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Should we stay or go, fear of moving back to the UK!
« on: January 11, 2019, 10:37:51 PM »
Hi Everyone
not even sure if I am posting correctly here!

We left the UK 7 years ago to move to Connecticut for work, our kids at the time were 5 and 8. It was never our intention to stay but work kept sweetening the deal. Now we have green cards and mortgage a property, I run a small business and my older boy is happy here, Freshman in HS!  The deal is no longer sweet and life is expensive here !  with the looming talk of college, we simply have nothing saved to pay for it. Healthcare costs and utilities are through the roof. 

With that being said, we are lucky to live in a wonderful town, it has an excellent school system, its kind of a bubble of an existence I feel, good for the kids, they can be kids and simply be whoever they want to be.

We have been applying for jobs back home, and hope to be leaving with all things being in place by June 2019.  It will mean my husband going first and us following when school is out and fingers crossed the house gets sold.

I have chatted with a couple of members on here back in Nov and would love some perspectives from you all, on cost of living, education, social acceptance (worried my kids are now so Americanized will British kids accept them) I only have my view of growing up in the UK and it wasn't pretty, kids are mean, school was tough !  Did anyone put their kids into a UK school system to find they needed to change to private, or apply to a grammar school?  And for those that are used to everything being so on demand and convenient in the States have you adjusted to life in the UK, is the pace slower?  lastly, has anyone got older kids that they made the move with and started at either GCSE level or Sixth Form?

thank you all
 :) :)
Claire


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Re: Should we stay or go, fear of moving back to the UK!
« Reply #1 on: January 12, 2019, 09:53:13 AM »
My absolute biggest concern would be schooling.  It would be HARD to try to move in high school.  Does your oldest know what he wants to be when he grows up?  Because he would be put on that path pretty much straight away.

My other concern is Brexit.  I’d wait and see how this circus plays out, personally.  There is a very good chance that the economy will tank and prices will skyrocket on everything here.

Keep in mind university isn’t free anymore here.  £9,000/year for tuition whether you are at a good school or crap school.

Not trying to be a Debbie Downer, just making sure you know the grass isn’t necessarily greener.
« Last Edit: January 13, 2019, 02:14:18 PM by KFdancer »


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Re: Should we stay or go, fear of moving back to the UK!
« Reply #2 on: January 12, 2019, 12:06:51 PM »

I wouldn't underestimate just how much this country is going crazy about Brexit.  Just the other day, the government advised stores to hire extra security guards in case of riots caused by food shortages.  There have been better times to move here.

Maybe someone else more knowledgable could chime in, but just to lay out the massive difference:

In the UK, it does indeed cost 9k per year to go to University, but that seems to be set up explicitly for the kid to pay.  It's a student loan that doesn't have to be paid back until the kid's salary hits a certain level, and the whole thing is written off after a certain period of time.  This could mean that the OP doesn't have to pay a penny and her kid's could get a university education.  I can't imagine many people here being able to pay upfront for uni for their kids since wages are so low .

Did we mention wages?  Wages here haven't gone up in 10 years! 

If it weren't for Brexit, OP's children could study in English for free in many EU countries. 


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Re: Should we stay or go, fear of moving back to the UK!
« Reply #3 on: January 12, 2019, 12:16:37 PM »
In the UK, it does indeed cost 9k per year to go to University, but that seems to be set up explicitly for the kid to pay.  It's a student loan that doesn't have to be paid back until the kid's salary hits a certain level, and the whole thing is written off after a certain period of time.  This could mean that the OP doesn't have to pay a penny and her kid's could get a university education.  I can't imagine many people here being able to pay upfront for uni for their kids since wages are so low .

Something to bear in mind though is that even if your kids are UK citizens, they won't qualify for UK/home fees or student loans unless they have lived in the UK for at least 3 years immediately before the start date of their university course.

International fees are somewhere around £12,000 to 20,000 per year... so depending on when you're able to move to the UK, you might not have been here for quite 3 years at the time your eldest starts university.


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Re: Should we stay or go, fear of moving back to the UK!
« Reply #4 on: January 12, 2019, 01:18:47 PM »
My absolute biggest concern would be schooling.  It would be HARD to try to move in high school.  Does your oldest know what he wants to be when he grows up?  Because he would be put on that path pretty much straight away.

My other concern is Brexit.  I’d wait and see how this circus plays out, personally.  There is a very good chance that the economy will tank and prices will skyrocket on everything here.

Keep in my university isn’t free anymore here.  £9,000/year for tuition whether you are at a good school or crap school.

Not trying to be a Debbie Downer, just making sure you know the grass isn’t necessarily greener.

If there was a way to qualify as a Scottish student, the fees are considerably less.

https://www.gla.ac.uk/undergraduate/fees/scottish/#/tuitionfees2019/20

But the three-year issue rears its head.  On the one hand, they could get jobs and work for three years, saving up funds to help pay for school, and then when they were sure what program they wanted to do, they'd be both residents and have the fees saved up.  I'm not sure how the admissions process would work for them then, as they would not be doing the same kind of application as a foreign student. It's something to check out in advance. (In the States, pretty much if you have the grades/test scores and cash to pay for it, and are not applying to a highly selective school, you can just pick a uni and go. Not sure it works that way here at all.)

On the other hand, a lot of people seem to think a kid absolutely has to go to uni straight out of high school. (For some that may be good, but on the whole I think it's a mistake. I was an academic advisor at a uni for several years, and saw so many students who were not mature enough to handle it, or who had signed on for a program they later found out they hated, but were tied to. It was sad.)  My daughter got a two year degree in a foreign language at a community college in the States, and then was in the workforce for several years. During her time working she got a definite appreciation for what it was like to work at lower-level jobs, which gave her incentive to go back to Uni. Plus, during that time, she decided what she really wanted to study. It's a lot easier to sort that out when you're not 18. She went as a "transfer" student to a US uni that paid for her to do Ed Abroad over here for a year and a half. As she was older, and had been working, she qualified as an independent student. Which brought in completely free tuition and fees at her school, because her income was so low. (They did not figure into the equation that she lived at home, nor was she required to report that.)  So she did her final two of her four years of undergrad at a major research uni at the States, but was only actually there for 1 year in total (including summer session). And it was all free. Plus, they gave her money for books and travel.

She did her first graduate degree over here. The tuition for a one year master's degree, for a foreign national, was about 18,000 pounds.

There are scholarships, some of them quite decent, if the student is of exceptional quality.  It's something to consider. If a Scottish uni might be of interest, check the Saltire scholarships, and others. The time to really start beating the bushes for undergrad scholarships is in the student's Junior year of high school (in the States). We know someone who cobbled together most of their fee payments out of a dozen small scholarships.

Good luck!  I don't envy you this decision.
« Last Edit: January 12, 2019, 04:11:00 PM by Nan D. »


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Re: Should we stay or go, fear of moving back to the UK!
« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2019, 03:16:11 PM »
thank you so much everyone, you all have great valid points which make total sense. The 3 year college rule, is the reason for needing to return ASAP so we qualify for home fees. So much to consider, Brexit is a concern and we would have to rent until the country stabilizes. Hearing your views is the reason for joining this forum, I can ask my British friends until I am blue in the face and none of them would admit to the points you bring up, so thank you all very much. Happy to hear more if you think if anything. THANK YOU!!!
Claire


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Re: Should we stay or go, fear of moving back to the UK!
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2019, 03:19:30 PM »
actually, with all that being said from your comments, the big question is: are you in the right place for you? can you happily live in England despite the feedback? what do you MISS about the USA?
Claire


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Re: Should we stay or go, fear of moving back to the UK!
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2019, 03:56:47 PM »
actually, with all that being said from your comments, the big question is: are you in the right place for you? can you happily live in England despite the feedback? what do you MISS about the USA?

I’m never quite sure.  I’m definitely nervous about Brexit.  It’s an absolute shitstorm.  For people to have voluntarily voted to send the country into economic crisis with no plan is mind blowing.  But I have two homes here that I wouldn’t be able to sell (nothing is moving in this market with all the uncertainty).  My husband and I are praying that we will still have jobs.

My kids are young (4 and 1).  We will likely move to the USA for secondary education as we like the USA education system more.  But that’s a personal preference.  I don’t think one system is better than the other, I just think the USA system allows kids to be kids a bit longer, which I like.  I like all the extracurricular activities available and encouraged in the USA.  Here it is so academic focused.

What I miss about the USA:  space.  Oh, I miss space!  Storage space, garages, green space, big yards, separation between houses.  Glorious space!  And the simplicity of life.  It’s so easy to DO in the USA.  And the roads.  Big wide roads not full of potholes or road works.  And mailboxes with the little red flag and yellow school buses.  And the work/life balance.  The ease of seeing a doctor when you need to.  Air conditioning, efficient insulation and dry homes, screens to keep bugs out.  Big kitchens that everyone gathers in.  And most of all, family. 

All that being said, I AM happy in the UK.  I have wonderful friends, a job I enjoy (though the big brother aspect of the UK workplace gets old).  I do a good job of keeping a social calendar going.  I try to do things unique to this side of the ocean with my husband and family to experience things only available here.  I lined the streets for both Will and Harry’s weddings.  I enjoy the lazy dining style where you can sit at the table all evening.  And my favourite of all - online grocery shopping.


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Re: Should we stay or go, fear of moving back to the UK!
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2019, 06:53:48 PM »
You nailed all the things I miss!

And you also nailed how I try to live my life here.

But since all of my kids are grown, I have no reason to move back. I'm quite comfortable here and it gets easier every week.

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk



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Re: Should we stay or go, fear of moving back to the UK!
« Reply #9 on: January 14, 2019, 09:22:04 AM »
I was thinking about this thread on the way to work this morning.  It's a bit like the "Do American's really have a room just for laundry?" thread.

I started to almost weep at the idea of a COAT CLOSET.  A closet JUST for your coats and outdoor stuff.  Oh sweet baby Jesus, a closet near the front door for that unsightly pile of coats and bags and boots.  And a closet that FITS A VACUUM.  And a broom.  So  you don't have your vacuum, broom, and mop on display for the whole world to see because where the heck do you put it?!?
« Last Edit: January 14, 2019, 11:37:51 AM by KFdancer »


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Re: Should we stay or go, fear of moving back to the UK!
« Reply #10 on: January 14, 2019, 11:25:03 AM »
I started to almost weep at the idea of a COAT CLOSET.  A closet JUST for your coats and outdoor stuff.  Oh sweet baby Jesus, a closet near the front door for that unsightly pile of coats and bags and boots.  A a closet that FITS A VACUUM.  And a broom.  So  you don't have your vacuum, broom, and mop on display for the whole world to see because where the heck do you put it?!?

Coat closets!  I miss those!  [smiley=bigcry.gif] I had forgotten they even existed!!  ;)


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Re: Should we stay or go, fear of moving back to the UK!
« Reply #11 on: January 14, 2019, 11:33:11 AM »
Coat closets!  I miss those!  [smiley=bigcry.gif] I had forgotten they even existed!!  ;)

I was thinking about the random closets in my parents' house this morning and just how practical they are for storing the stuff I just can't rid of but don't want to be ruined by the damp in the loft - camping equipment, winter clothes during summer, memory boxes of photos etc...

Mostly I miss food - my favourite sandwich shop, In N Out burger, my favourite taqueria etc...

I also favour the American education system. I was a teacher here for 7 years and really really question many aspects of the UK education system. I even wonder if it will exist in 10 years the way it's going!! The focus on 'qualifications' instead of learning and understanding is still very foreign to me. It is also shocking that the students seem to need the carrot of that 'qualification' to try!!! But hey, I could talk about this for days and won't bore you here!!
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Re: Should we stay or go, fear of moving back to the UK!
« Reply #12 on: January 14, 2019, 11:38:44 AM »
I was thinking about the random closets in my parents' house this morning and just how practical they are for storing the stuff I just can't rid of but don't want to be ruined by the damp in the loft - camping equipment, winter clothes during summer, memory boxes of photos etc...

Mostly I miss food - my favourite sandwich shop, In N Out burger, my favourite taqueria etc...

I also favour the American education system. I was a teacher here for 7 years and really really question many aspects of the UK education system. I even wonder if it will exist in 10 years the way it's going!! The focus on 'qualifications' instead of learning and understanding is still very foreign to me. It is also shocking that the students seem to need the carrot of that 'qualification' to try!!! But hey, I could talk about this for days and won't bore you here!!

How much longer for you Kate?  Due date must be getting close!


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Re: Should we stay or go, fear of moving back to the UK!
« Reply #13 on: January 14, 2019, 12:40:18 PM »
Coat closets!  I miss those!  [smiley=bigcry.gif] I had forgotten they even existed!!  ;)

We have 2 coat closets off the entrance hall in our house, one we use for coats the other for stuff like vacuum cleaner, shopping bags, brush and pan etc. This closet also has room for shoes including a low shelf but we bought a shoe cabinet from IKEA which stores them out of sight but make them much more accessible than on the floor or shelf of our under-the-stairs closet.

https://www.ikea.com/gb/en/products/small-storage-organisers/shoe-cabinets/hemnes-shoe-cabinet-with-2-compartments-grey-art-60403895/

The houses we visit most are our son, sister and that of good friends, all within a short walk of where we live. Not thought of it before this thread but only our friends have a coat closet in the entrance hall of the front door. Our son has a nice roomy entrance porch which has coat hangers and a shoe rack. His closet under the stairs is off his main room and is where he keeps his vacuum cleaner cleaner and stuff.  My sister's house has no coat closet or entrance porch but does have a cupboard under the stairs which is where I assume she stores her vacuum cleaner and stuff as they are not in view anywhere.
Dual USC/UKC living in the UK since May 2016


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Re: Should we stay or go, fear of moving back to the UK!
« Reply #14 on: January 14, 2019, 03:38:20 PM »
actually, with all that being said from your comments, the big question is: are you in the right place for you? can you happily live in England despite the feedback? what do you MISS about the USA?

Not sure if this was aimed at one person, or a general question. If one person, please disregard the following. If general:   England? No, I could never live in England.  Scotland, however, is great.

What do I miss? Most are trivialities - some of the foods I was fond of are unheard of here. The sidewalks not rolling up at six in the evening. The ease of getting over-the-counter medications that here are prescription. The lower cost for durable goods and the availability of lower-priced shoes of decent quality. (Example:  I was just out to city center to look to see if there were any sales on electric kettles or coffee makers. Just the cheap kind that I could set up on a timer and have hot water for my tea, or run water through coffee grounds for coffee. In the States I could have picked one up for maybe $20 at Target. The cheapest thing I could find here was 60 pounds (or about $78). Uh, nooo, not! I keep forgetting when I put the percolator on, so I have to put a kitchen timer on it as well or end up with burnt coffee. And the price of electric toothbrushes is rediculous!)  I miss not having to go on a treasure hunt to find things that were readily available in the States. (I ended up ordering off Amazon when I was looking for a heavy-duty extension cord that did not end in a surge protector. I'd been to the DIY stores, and several likely shops here, and all I could find were the surge-protector ones. And it cost way more than it should have.)  There was a bit more punctuality in the USA, both socially and in the trades. Speaking of trades,  I live in a mid-range apartment. Not expensive by any means, but the housing association touted it as one of their better flats. The quality of the workmanship is a bit less than I would have expected - they did a rehab of the flat before I moved in. There were still pencil marks on the floors from where they made the cuts in the lumber, sticky residue on the windows from where the labels were, the sink in the bathroom is at a wonky angle. The under-cabinet lights in the kitchen keep blowing out the bulbs, and there's a switch on the wall that doesn't seem to control anything.The appliances are far from top-of-the-line. Whatever service they had clean the place did a decent job, except they didn't touch the top of the cabinets. Quite a grease slick up there - took many hours of scrubbing to get rid of. Ick! So overall, nothing hideous, I just miss little things. Lots of little things that add up to a sort of generic annoyance, at times. I also miss being able to socialize without there being an expectation that vast quantities of alcohol will be involved. This island (both north and south of the border) has a serious problem with alcohol. I'm not pressured at all to drink, but there are times when it's just not a lot of fun being the sober person at a table full of people whose brains have gotten pickled.

But, really, am I in the right place for me? Yes, definitely. It's waaaaay more laid back here. I generally enjoy the culture - Glasgow is very 'working class' and friendly. I grew up in that sort of environment, so although I've moved in academic circles for 30 years I can easily switch back and forth and am comfortable with both.  The sense of humor in the Glasgow general culture is right up my ally, too.  ;) And it's so green here! I love the climate. When I was a young child I lived in the NE USA, so having real winters (like we did last year, which I'm told was unusal) again was fun. Of course, I'm retired so I can just look at it out the window, which is very different from having to get to work in it. And the summers here do not get too hot. It's also nice about the light. As in, back in California I had to wear photogray lenses all year long, because the sun was so strong it hurt my eyes. I have been able to switch to normal glass lenses here, on all but a couple of days a year, and no headaches. Doesn't set off a migraine. Or sunburns. The sun is just not strong enough here to produce (on my skin) anything more than a light tan. It's lovely.  A bit dampish at times, but lovely and green.

Plus, although income taxes are twice as high here, the cost of living is hella cheaper than in SoCal, and I do not need to own (and maintain, pay taxes on, or garage) a car, so that's a plus. If I need to go somewhere a bus doesn't go, in town, I just call a cab. Which are also hella cheaper than in California. The distances between cities here are very small, comparatively speaking. And there are trains, so I don't have to fly unless I want to (I don't really care for flying). Plus I am not paying through the nose for a private insurance cover, and can use the NHS. Granted when I was working in the States all I could afford was the HMO cover my employer offered, not the more expensive (and much better) PPO option,  but a policy out of pocket would have run me into 4 figures if I'd had to have bought one there now.  So I don't have that cost here. In return, the NHS is remarkably like a HMO. From my experience so far, not the top-tier of care, but perfectly adequate. (Caveat - I haven't seen the GP for anything complicated, so I have to base my opinion on my daughter's experiences and our dealing with NHS dental.)  It is somewhat astounding to me to think that if I'm hiking up a hill in the Highlands and fall and break a leg, and they have to airlift me to a hospital, I'm not going to get a bill for $50,000 that the insurance won't cover. They'll just take me to the hospital. That is SOOOOOO cool! Not having to worry about being bankrupted for/by emergency care.

Hope that all helps you, somehow. :D
« Last Edit: January 14, 2019, 03:47:50 PM by Nan D. »


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