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Topic: how would u handle this?  (Read 1439 times)

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how would u handle this?
« on: September 17, 2003, 10:10:18 PM »
My husband has just recieved his "review" from the employees that he manages at work.
I find this a little strange since he was never "reviewed" by his employees in the States. I've never reviewed my employers.. :-/

Anyhow,
Seems they are generally pleased w/ his performance skills but feels he lacks in social skills.
I.E  -He does'nt like to go out drinking after work.

This seems to be a big deal here in KL to socialise after work.

Almost all of the employees are in their 20's w/ no spouse or kids.
My hubby has "been there done that" with drinking and partys when he was in college...but he's 36 now and has no interest in those things. He just wants to come home and relax.

His boss (the German beer guzzler) tells him he needs to make more of an effort to join in...even if he does'nt want to.

The boss also said that "it's just something the asians do...a cultural thing".

We join the group once in a while, but def. not for any late night binges.

I tell him to do what he wants...who cares what they think, right?!
But at the same time I don't want this to be a prob later...(as in ...people who gossip and then it gets back to head office he's no good with "social skills").
Like I said, it seems to be a big deal here...even w/ the top brass.

What do you guys think? How do you think he should he handle this?     ???



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Re: how would u handle this?
« Reply #1 on: September 17, 2003, 10:24:29 PM »
Well, first of all, I think that if that's the only real *issue* they could think of, your husband is one helluva manager :)  Second of all, I think he should continue to be as he has been.  I truly believe there *needs* to be a line between manager and managed.  Mingle too much, or worse yet, and most employees will lose sight of that line between you and them, and it may affect job performance.  I'd say going every now and then and tossing back a bew or two is fine and dandy, but if his employees expect him to go out and be *one of the guys* then they're simply expecting too much.
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Re: how would u handle this?
« Reply #2 on: September 17, 2003, 10:40:56 PM »
My dh used to work for a large credit card company and employee reviews of managers were an annual thing, so this is not new to me.  What is new is the idea that something like "hanging out with the guys" is part of it!

I say, have him step up the socialising a little bit...but don't seriously change the way you do things.  I agree there needs to be a separation.  Perhaps you two would like to have a barbecue and invite the employees?  That would probably be good for a few months' worth of pints.


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Re: how would u handle this?
« Reply #3 on: September 17, 2003, 11:01:01 PM »
Hi Kiki, well I actually have practical experience in this same thing.  I worked for a small department for one person.  But all the support staff sorta sat in the same pool.  Basically, I don't socialize much at all.  It wasn't about THEM.  It was just my preference.  So they asked a few times would I go with them after work.  But I made excuses.  I would go to lunch though.  But then even those invitations dried up.  Next they stopped talking to me.  Even if I directly asked one of them something.  If I came into the break room.  All talking stopped until I left.  I stayed at that job for 6 months.  I left cause it was too much pressure.

Frankly I believe as Leland and Saf do that there should be separation.  But I had the experience I had as well.  I have those concerns when I start working in Wales as well.  I wasn't a manager in any sense.  But even when they hired someone and she sat right next to me, she got the scoop and didn't engaged me in conversation unless no one else was around to help her.

I'm not sure I'd try harder to hang out more.  But I should have tried to make them understand my side.  I did not try to explain my side to these people, and of course, they never asked.  Just assumed.  I didn't ostracize them for hanging out after work.  I should have been left alone as well (in my opinion).  I wish for my own sake I had tried.  I would have not been as bitter when I left.  

« Last Edit: September 17, 2003, 11:03:40 PM by Kizmet122800 »
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Re: how would u handle this?
« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2003, 02:46:12 AM »
Sadly, I do think joining in with 'extra-curricular' activities has a bearing on the way one is perceived in the workplace.

The company I work for is largely composed of young people, who are madly social. When I joined the company, I went to a couple of drinks things, but left early - after one or two drinks. They were all there until closing time. I politely declined the invitation to the Christmas party and much pressure was placed upon me to attend our summer party - a whole day taken for an out-of-London jaunt.

After ten minutes of travelling to the venue, I knew I'd made a mistake and I beat a hasty retreat back to London shortly after we arrived. (It always pays to have some 'f*** off' money in one's wallet.)

I feel it has certainly had an effect on the way higher management interacts with me, although I was right to do so, I think. Everyone was drunk within minutes, people were sick, did incredibly stupid and embarrassing things - all in the name of 'fun' you understand. (I'm by no means teetotal, but I know where and when I like to let my hair down - and, trust me, I do. More than most of them, probably.)

Anyway, it would seem that it's looked upon more favourably to join in, behave atrociously and be 'game for a laugh' than quietly preferring to leave them to it. I'm 39 - I don't need to be defined by having sick down my pullover. I did that sort of thing many years ago and grew out of it.

It's terribly difficult... although it shouldn't matter, it probably does. I suppose the only way to look upon it is that one is being true to oneself - at the end of the day, you have to face yourself and I'd rather irritate my workmates by appearing 'stand-offish' than force myself into a round of unwelcome, unnecessary and expensive after-work partying. If one's colleagues can't understand that, then it's their loss.


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Re: how would u handle this?
« Reply #5 on: September 18, 2003, 03:01:21 AM »
interesting.... I have had similar experiences with my nursing collleagues.  It seems to be a pretty regular thing to have "drinks" after work and last years CHristmas party turned into a drunken wild night (missed it- good excuse as I was 5 months pregnant)  all these events would include nurse managers/bosses- that was never an issue.  I have never been at a job where there was so much socialing in bars/pubs.

Is this an English thing?
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Re: how would u handle this?
« Reply #6 on: September 18, 2003, 09:51:45 AM »
Your 'employer reviews' are 360 Degree feedback, and it is gaining a great deal of popularity all over the world as being a good way to get top down, bottom up feedback on performance which makes any kind of pay reviews or performance reviews more robust and effective.  So it isn't at all unusual.

I've found it is definitely a bit 'British' thing to go out after work and get pissed.  Just seems to be what happens!

Here in London, even at my job, it is very common for after work 'do's' to be socially mandatory.  I had a problem with going to the pub after work because I don't drink.  So I have a policy to only go for one drink (a diet coke) and I then politely take my leave.  People know that pubs just aren't my thing and they don't seem to have a problem with that at all.  And I am considered very open and friendly with people, even those I manage.

Has your hubby considered doing things like holding meetings at a coffee shop instead of in an office?  Especially with people he manages, he could score some serious social points if he bought them a cup of coffee whilst discussing progress on a project with them.  Just an idea!  :)

I think it may be that being social with colleagues probably is a lot more to do with working style than after work functions.  I've found people are very understanding about my not being involved in the big binges and pub crawls.  As long as I make it clear that I don't enjoy things like that and that it isn't any thing personal...and that I'm consistent about it...they don't mind at all.  Being more social is probably more about being a bit less stiff lipped in meetings and loosening up around the coffee pot than it does about going out after work.  



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Re: how would u handle this?
« Reply #7 on: September 18, 2003, 02:41:02 PM »
I agree with you, Wish...From talking with my b/f (he's a manager at his work) & esp. from being at my current job, being social outside/inside the workplace with colleagues is something that goes on much more here than seems to be in the US.  It also seems to be that if pubs and such aren't your thing, if you just let your colleagues know this is why you go, but leave early and such - people are very understanding, and don't treat you any differently over it.  Of course, if they don't realise that's why you don't socialise, and/or leave early, it leaves it easy for them to think of many other reasons for what could look anti-social to them.

Hope all this (and what others have said) helps! :)

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Re: how would u handle this?
« Reply #8 on: September 18, 2003, 07:55:48 PM »
Hi ,thanks for the responses!

When i worked in Cincinnati I had a Japanese manager. I saw first hand how he did things in the states. Like any normal Amer. family man.

But when he went back to Japan on business trips it was all about drinking,parties,hanky panky etc...

Well that's about the same here in KL (w/out the hanky panky):).

It's considered an insult if you don't join in with the group.
My hubby usually has a diet coke or two, stays an hour or so and says his good-byes.
They really put the pressure on him to drink. Constantly asking why he won't drink and making comments on this.
On one occasion some of the office gals tried persistantly to pull him out on the dance floor. (Which i found quite funny!-ha )
He would'nt budge...and found it annoying, since they were all hammered.
They don't understand Amer. or German way of doing things. Just like we don't understand their way of doing things.
Explaining this to them won't make a difference...well,that's what we were told by other expats.

My hubby goes out to lunch with most of them everyday.

My sweet man works 12 hrs a day,6 days a week (unlike in the States <sigh>)...so believe me, he see's more of them than  he does me.
Is it any wonder he wants to come home and relax?  :P  

Guess we'll just have to "conform" SOMEWHAT to their way of doing things.  "When in Rome..."


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Re: how would u handle this?
« Reply #9 on: September 18, 2003, 11:06:54 PM »
Quote
I have never been at a job where there was so much socialing in bars/pubs.

Is this an English thing?


Not as such. Most of the people I know finish work and go home. There're the occasional after-work get-togethers, maybe if it's someone's birthday or special occasion, but it's not really the norm (not in my experience anyway). Friday lunch is probably a more traditional time to have a drink and socialise with work colleagues, but again it's all down to individual preferences / working environments.

I guess the after-work thing may be more common in central London as people can have a drink and wait out the evening rush-hour.

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Re: how would u handle this?
« Reply #10 on: September 19, 2003, 01:59:32 AM »
I have a feeling that this phenomenon is something to do with the recent trend for team-building exercises taken to an (il)logical extreme.

It seems it's not enough to turn up, do one's job well and contribute to your working environment in that way; it's now important to demonstrate that you're one of the gang too.

As I've said to my colleagues on many occasions, it's better that I don't attend these sort of functions. Half an hour of my boot-face is enough to sour the atmosphere for everyone. Far preferable to let me go home when I want to and turn up in the morning looking happy and ready to tackle the day ahead.

Having said that, I've gone out with individuals and had a fantastic time. I think it's all part of not belonging to the 'sheep' mentality. I can't abide organised, corporate jollity.

What a Scrooge I am - bah, humbug!


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