Question re: Provisional Driver's License

Being British, this is a little outside my experience with dealing with the DVLA, but isn't there a way to use some other document? 

According to the current ID requirements here

http://www.dvla.gov.uk/drivers/photocard_licences.htm#6

one acceptable form of ID is "Travel Documents issued by the Home Office."   COuld that possibly include a letter confirming legal residency in the country? 

Just a thought. 

A 'Home Office Travel Document' is a specific document issued to refugees and others who are unable to get a passport from their own consulate.

Vicky

Ah, O.K.   You learn something new every day. 

I can't make out what the difference is between these two entries either:

UK Birth/Adoption certificate
Certificate of Registry of Birth (Provided your name is present on the certificate)

The second option doesn't specify it must be from the U.K.   (I'm just trying to find anything here to get round the passport issue.)

I guess that the registry of birth would be for a UK national who was born overseas and get a registry of birth certificate from the British Embassy.

I see what you're doing, but I have a feeling there is no alternative.

Vicky

There is no alternative.  Non-UK passport holders must send their passports away in order to obtain a provisional license.   

I sent mine away (special delivery both ways) and haven't received it back yet....today is the 11th working day.  I want my passport back NOW!   

I know, I was nervous about sending my passport too. I'm sure we all were. But if you are a US citizen, i.e. not Brit, EU, Canadian, or a few other countries they list for special terms, there doesn't seem to be any alternative. I understand their need to check identities - the US has been lax about such things in the past and has caused problems, so now they are tightening up; I just don't like mailing it away.

But I did it and it worked out fine. I was surprised, actually, when it came back. It took mine exactly one week, and I was confused by the envelope thinking "what could this be" because I was expecting longer. And yep, I used recorded delivery. I asked about the options at the post office, and when the woman said "this one is traceable at every step to its destination" I replied "Lets do THAT one!"

There is no alternative.  Non-UK passport holders must send their passports away in order to obtain a provisional license.   

I sent mine away (special delivery both ways) and haven't received it back yet....today is the 11th working day.  I want my passport back NOW!   

Ah!  Mine has just arrived!   

Oh, I'm glad I didn't go to the DVLA office in Glasgow yesterday!  I got a call from someone at the Glasgow Job Centre telling me that an appointment was cancelled this Wednesday and asked if I wanted it!!
So, I can go to the NI number appointment, then to the DVLA the same day.   Seems like it'll work out well (hopefully!)

I know this doesn't affect Americans, but if the listed items are indeed correct, I wonder how an Irish citizen is supposed to apply then?

Taking the list of acceptable documents one by one:

Full Valid Current Passport  -- Irish citizens do not need a passport to come to the U.K.
UK Birth/Adoption certificate -- Wouldn't have one.
Certificate of Registry of Birth (Provided your name is present on the certificate) -- If Vicky's explanation is correct, this wouldn't apply either.
ID Card issued by a member state of the EC/EEA -- No ID cards in Ireland.
Travel Documents issued by the Home Office -- Not applicable.
UK Certificate of Naturalisation -- Wouldn't have one if not naturalized.

So what's he supposed to do?   Pay out money for a passport that he doesn't need just to get a driver's license?   

Or is this another case of DVLA imposing limitations which aren't actually specified by law?   

Relating this back to the problems of coming here from the U.S., I just spent a few minutes trawling through some of the relevant legislation on tjhe OPSI website, and I can't find anything which says that you need to obtain a provisional license before taking the test, so long as you're still within the 12-month validity of your U.S. license:

The Motor Vehicles (Driving Licences) Regulations 1987

Persons who become resident in Great Britain
    25.—(1)  A person who becomes resident in Great Britain shall during the period of one year after he becomes so resident be treated for the purposes of section 84(1) and (2) of the 1972 Act as the holder of a licence authorising him to drive motor vehicles of the classes which he is authorised to drive by any permit of which he is a holder, if he satisfies the conditions specified in paragraph (2).

I think I might e-mail DVLA and ask for a reference to the applicable law.

I know this doesn't affect Americans, but if the listed items are indeed correct, I wonder how an Irish citizen is supposed to apply then?

Well how does an Irish citizen prove that they're Irish for other official purposes (like being able to work in the UK?)  Wouldn't they need something like these above documents (like a passport) in order to do so? Or does an Irish birth certificate suffice-I've no idea since I don't know anything about Irish nationality laws.  Just something random I was wondering....

/end hijack 

The DVLA is the only agency here where i've come across indignant and grumpy people.  This is a sign to me that that burocracy is broken.  It is so difficult to get the whole picture from them and they do not make it simple to drive in this country when you come from abroad.  

I'm not a bad driver.  I've never been in an accident (rear ended once at a stop light - so not my fault!) nor do I have any points on my license, in any country!  But they make me feel like I am a bad driver, for which I'm getting a bit resentful and it is now eating away at my confidence on the road.  I'm second guessing everything I do!  

I will be so, so happy to have this over with.  

Why can't the local office be authorised to check documents?  why is it necessary to send them through the post to have them checked in  Swansea?  

I know this is a necessary evil and I'm just complaining - I'm sorry.  It's just a frustration that I'm having  difficulty accommodating right now.  thanks for listening to my gripes!

Well how does an Irish citizen prove that they're Irish for other official purposes (like being able to work in the UK?)

I would assume that an Irish birth certificate would suffice for most things.  Remember that the whole of Ireland was actually part of the U.K. from 1801 until 1921.   After partition, there were no immigration restrictions, so British citizens were free to move to the Irish Republic and Irish citizens needed no permission to live and work in the U.K.    We can even vote in each other's elections if resident.

Maybe DVLA's reference to a U.K. birth certificate should include an Irish Republic birth certificate as well.  Who knows with DVLA? 

The DVLA is the only agency here where i've come across indignant and grumpy people.  This is a sign to me that that burocracy is broken.  It is so difficult to get the whole picture from them and they do not make it simple to drive in this country when you come from abroad. 

I find it ridiculous that under EU regulations we're now forced to just exchange a license from Greece or Estonia, but the law still ties Americans and Canadians up in all this red tape of having to take the test.   

The other problem is that DVLA often tries to impose its own restrictions which have no basis in law.  For example, it's a devil of a job to get some staff there to acknowledge that to tax a car you do not have to produce an insurance certificate specific to the vehicle.

I have fired off a quick e-mail asking for clarification and references to the appropriate legislation regarding ID and the agency's insistence that you obtain a "provisional" license before taking the test.     I'll keep you posted when I receive an answer.

Thanks Paul.  I appreciate you looking into these things.   

UberYank, did you have any problems at the DVLA with the online application printout? I applied for my provisional license online and went to the Birmingham DVLA this morning and they all nearly had a heart attack. They didn't know what to do with it and kept saying that the online app is for UK citizens only even though it doesn't say that anywhere. I had to fill out a regular application and nearly had to pay the fee again (I made a big enough stink and they relented).

I didn't go to the Glasgow DVLA yet, because I am looking for a job and I keep having to show my passport everywhere.  I know that if I don't mail my application in w/my passport within 28days they will refund the money to me, so I'm okay with that.  A job is more important at the moment (I'm SO bored staying home!)