Garnishment of wages

I'm not sure where to post this topic so if it needs to be moved then go ahead....

Can Collection Agencies in the US Garnish or Attach wages earned in another country while you are living in said other country and filing with the IRS every year?

Not sure what this has to do with taxes, but anyway...

Wage garnishments in the US are administered through part of the US court system (at the state or local level).  It would be very difficult, if not well nigh impossible, for a US collection agency to pursue a wage garnishment through another country's court system - say the UK's, because it is outside of the US court system's jurisdiction...different country's legal system, different laws, different process, etc.

There is the slight possibility, although I would say quite unlikely, that the debt could be sold on to a different collection agency actually within the UK (for the sake of this example) - which could then possibly pursue the debtor through the UK court system's process for that (County Court Judgement, Attachment of Earnings, etc).  I have heard of one instance of a UK debt being sold on to a US collection agency, but I've not heard of any going the other direction.  The other question would also be is the debt even enforceable in a different country, as the contract law under which a debt was taken out would have been according to the laws in the country where it was contracted.

One possible exception to this, which would involve taxes incidentally - student loan debt never goes away, as it's debt guaranteed by the US government.  If the government cannot collect on the debt any other way, they will withhold any US tax refunds to which you might be eligible until the debt is repaid.

Taxes, back child support, student loan debt.  Stuff like that if they don't go after you what they may do is not renew your passport, I guess.  Not sure.  Can you apply for bankrupcy.  I had a bankrupcy in the US before I left.  I did have student loan debt, which was not discharged, but after I became fully vested with a company I used to work for a few years later I used those monies to pay that debt.

One possible exception to this, which would involve taxes incidentally - student loan debt never goes away, as it's debt guaranteed by the US government.  If the government cannot collect on the debt any other way, they will withhold any US tax refunds to which you might be eligible until the debt is repaid.

If you owe a debt to a government related entity, which includes (from unfortunate personal experience) a state university, they can just bring charges against you and then garnishment of wages is the last of your problems.

I'm fine (at the moment), but if DH looses his job then I guess we're in huge trouble.  I never thought of Child Support, Alimony, Student Debt and Taxes as I pretty much figured that those are taken very seriously.  I was thinking more along the lines of:

House can't sell in this market, market keeps going down so you end up with negative equity.  Even if house sells you are left owing money to the lender or a foreclosure.

Upside down on a Truck and a Boat.  If you hand them back to the lien holders and they then auction them off you are then liable for the difference which in my case would be about $10,000 on each. 

As I said none of this is an issue while DH still has a job.

But with the economy tanking and things not looking good I was just wondering about these things.  I have already talked with the Lien Holders about the truck and boat in a worst case scenario and they both said that they would be auctioned off with the remainder of the money being re-fied into a 2/3 yr personal loan.

Sometimes it feels tempting to just hand everything back    not that I want to as I hate having this debt over my head and would try to do everything in my power to pay off the losses accrued but if the house drops anymore I won't have any equity to pay those loses.  Realtor fees are just too damn high. 

The only thing stopping us moving back to the UK right now is my dog.  We want her to pass away first as we would never forgive ourselves if she died on the trip home to the UK.  She could have anywhere from weeks to months to a year or maybe more left.  12yr old German Shepherd Dog.  She just lost her 9 yr old younger brother which was a total shock out of nowhere.  DH & I decided that we didn't want to be alone in the US anymore going through the grieving process.  We want to be back with family in the UK.  Loss is inevitable in life and with parents getting older everyday I dread that phone call from the UK one day. 

Question is:- 

Do you define yourselves by what you own in life, eg..house, boat, truck, plasma tv, PS3 etc.. etc.. etc... or

Do you define yourselves by the relationships you have with those in your life and around you.

Both can make you happy but as my Mum always says "you can't take any of it with you and it's the good memories you leave behind that count the most".

So, during our recent grief a light bulb went off over our heads and we realized that we were chasing this materialistic happiness, trying to fill a void.  The void never fills up though when you aren't truly happy.  We now just want to go home (my home, my DH's home is where I am according to him ).  DH will be happy anywhere as long as he can go to a gym and fish .

So as you see by my nice long winded reply I was only thinking about the house, truck and boat debt. 

If you owe a debt to a government related entity, which includes (from unfortunate personal experience) a state university, they can just bring charges against you and then garnishment of wages is the last of your problems.

Mort, what sort of charges are you talking about?  All creditors are able to take a person to court if the debtor has defaulted on payment, and then wage garnishment may follow from a successful court judgement for the plaintiff - as the creditor's means to collect on the debt.  However, debt is a civil, not a criminal court matter.

For non-US gov debts (normal credit debts), it would be difficult for the creditor to collect on it if the person moves to another country - again going back to jurisdiction, different legal systems, etc as I previously explained.  Again, there is a chance it could follow you, if the lender sells it on to a collection agency in the country where you are, but this is rare AFAIK.

US-gov debts are different because they have more means available to them (and they are never forgotten), including:

* The Department of the Treasury may offset your federal and/or state tax refunds and any other payments, as authorized by law, to repay your defaulted loan.

* Also, you may be subject to Administrative Wage Garnishment, whereby the Department will require your employer to forward 15% of your disposable pay toward repayment of your loan.

* Federal employees face the possibility of having 15% of their disposable pay offset by the Department toward repayment of their loan through the Federal Employee Salary Offset Program.

And then apparently, they can also sue you in either in State or Federal District Court (higher courts than for normal credit debts).  If anyone has actual knowledge or experience of that & the consequences thereof, I'd be interested in hearing more about it.  I've not found anything specifically about them taking your passport off you, but that doesn't mean they couldn't. 

 I've not found anything specifically about them taking your passport off you, but that doesn't mean they couldn't. 

I only brought that up because some years ago there was a poster on here, long gone now, who had back child support in the US.  And when he went to get his UK-born child a US passport here, he had some problems arise.  I don't know what the end result of that was, and he went back to the US.

Mort, what sort of charges are you talking about?  All creditors are able to take a person to court if the debtor has defaulted on payment, and then wage garnishment may follow from a successful court judgement for the plaintiff - as the creditor's means to collect on the debt.  However, debt is a civil, not a criminal court matter.

For non-US gov debts (normal credit debts), it would be difficult for the creditor to collect on it if the person moves to another country - again going back to jurisdiction, different legal systems, etc as I previously explained.

US-gov debts are different because they have more means available to them (and they are never forgotten), including:

* The Department of the Treasury may offset your federal and/or state tax refunds and any other payments, as authorized by law, to repay your defaulted loan.

* Also, you may be subject to Administrative Wage Garnishment, whereby the Department will require your employer to forward 15% of your disposable pay toward repayment of your loan.

* Federal employees face the possibility of having 15% of their disposable pay offset by the Department toward repayment of their loan through the Federal Employee Salary Offset Program.

And then apparently, they can also sue you in either in State or Federal District Court (higher courts than for normal credit debts).  If anyone has actual knowledge or experience of that & the consequences thereof, I'd be interested in hearing more about it.  I've not found anything specifically about them taking your passport off you, but that doesn't mean they couldn't. 

I had heard that about Credit Card Debt and I know when it comes to Child Support & Student Loans etc they are pretty serious about finding you.  A truck and a boat loan with both Lien holders being Credit Unions, would that mean they fall under US Govt Debt then?

I too am interested in finding out more about this.  Obviously the best case scenario would be to walk away from the US clean but what if that isn't possible.  I mean lets be honest, a persons circumstances change all the time and none of us can predict our futures and what lies ahead for us.  If I ever thought that my precious 9yr old boy Shepherd would pass away so suddenly and turn our lives upside down I never would have bought the boat or the truck maybe and even the house.  Hindsight is all well and good but we don't have it so you have to make decisions in life based on your current situation and if you always thought and expected the worse all the time then life would pretty much suck and you wouldn't do anything, buy anything or go anywhere.

I only brought that up because some years ago there was a poster on here, long gone now, who had back child support in the US.  And when he went to get his UK-born child a US passport here, he had some problems arise.  I don't know what the end result of that was, and he went back to the US.

Yes, I think they can do special things for child support/child custody issues.  And maybe they can like that for US-gov debts as well - I've just not located any evidence to that effect.  So if anyone knows more about this, it would be good info to know. 

A truck and a boat loan with both Lien holders being Credit Unions, would that mean they fall under US Govt Debt then? 

Someone who knows more about US credit unions & how they work (than I do) will have to answer that.

I know what you mean, Alsatianx2, and in answering your questions - I hope no one misconstrues - I am not encouraging anyone not to pay their debts.  Obviously, if a person can, they should and make every effort to do so.  But demonising (and being judgemental about) people who are in debt (and sometimes people find themselves in a place with few options) is not the way to go either.    (and no one on this thread has done that, but I've seen it happen other places/other times)

I also think that creditors themselves need to accept more than a little culpability for some of the poor lending decisions they have made in recent years - we need only look to the current world financial situation now for proof of that.  But of course, when the banks can't pay their bills, the government (i.e., the taxpayers) bails them out and I doubt that we get to take them to court for it when they don't pay it back - do you?  But that's a whole other thread.

Child support is a special case.  They can get you when you go to renew your passport, but I don't know if it is true for other debts.  It wasn't a few years ago.

Mort, what sort of charges are you talking about?  All creditors are able to take a person to court if the debtor has defaulted on payment, and then wage garnishment may follow from a successful court judgement for the plaintiff - as the creditor's means to collect on the debt.  However, debt is a civil, not a criminal court matter.

When I was late (very late) paying my las tuition bill, I got a summons from AG of New York state to appear in Albany in criminal court, not civil. I'm positive this is true. I emailed my dad who still had the copy of the summons so he could send me the details and I'll post when I get them since it was over 7 years ago.

When I was late (very late) paying my las tuition bill, I got a summons from AG of New York state to appear in Albany in criminal court, not civil. I'm positive this is true. I emailed my dad who still had the copy of the summons so he could send me the details and I'll post when I get them since it was over 7 years ago.

Thanks, Mort! 

Thanks, Mort! 

BTW, it was a SUNY specifically I am referring to. That's what I meant by the government agency.

It's the first instance I've ever heard of a personal debt going into a criminal court, as normal credit debts cannot do that unless there's a matter of fraud being involved, which can be difficult to prove (or else something like bad checks which is easier to prove).  US-gov't backed is a bit of a greyer area & my searching about earlier seemed to suggest they can & will elevate it into the higher courts if they can't resolve it by other means - but I didn't find anything about criminal court specifically.  So yes, I'm interested in what happened there, Mort.

but since this is all just a hypothetical situation, Alsatian, perhaps it's just needless worrying to get worked up about just now.

i mean, if you lost your jobs and couldn't pay, wouldn't you file for bankrupcy?

i did, but i also had NO assets and was working temporary gigs when i could. 

also, IIRC the bankrupcy law has changed over there.  but mine was nearly 8 years ago and even then, the student loan debt was not discharged.