Its official - have to choose between fiance or my child. England or no.

I agree with the advice everyone is giving in this case, but remember that there are often many reasons why people "leave" their kids.  

A lot of non custodial parents might find some of the assumptions in this thread pretty awful.

I agree with the advice everyone is giving in this case, but remember that there are often many reasons why people "leave" their kids. 

A lot of non custodial parents might find some of the assumptions in this thread pretty awful.

Very true.

a) She's posted in a few other threads about him that makes people get a negative impression of him

Hmmm, good point. After reviewing some of the previous threads, I'm not entirely sure what's going on here. Every month or so the OP makes a post about how difficult the situation is, making out how unreasonable her fiancee is, and asks for 'honest opinions'. People are mostly reasonable and rational in their responses, she says she appreciates the advice, and then a month later starts a new thread about the same general issues.

Based on the history here, if the OP is actually serious in wanting advice, I think I'd have to side with the people saying that the option of moving to the UK is a complete dead end. Otherwise it seems like a waste of everyone's time, including the OP's, to continue to bring all this up every few weeks.

Its worthwhile to remember that there are lots of disordered people out there who are incapable of caring about anything other than their own immediate needs.  How do you know that you won't be ultimately dismissed by this man who has decided he doesn't have to have a relationship with his kids?  How do you know that this ultimatum isn't a way to cut you off now that you've displeased him for having your own feelings and concerns?

My advice is to educate yourself on the signs and characteristics of the various personality disorders to try to guess what exactly you are dealing with.

A person with depression or bipolar is much different from a Narcissist or a Psychopath.  Some people who have emotional or psychological issues work very hard to make the lives of their loved ones as good as possible.  Others are incapable of feeling empathy or remorse, and don't even notice the wreckage they leave behind them.  

I'm not talking about a non-custodial parent who has no choice but to be away from their children day-to-day.  This is about a person who manipulates with ultimatums, assumes entitlement and seems incapable of empathizing with a person he is supposed to love.

Thank you for everyone that is posted.  I do appreciate your responses.  It sounds as if I am bringing too many of my issues to this forum, and perhaps they are the same issues time and time again. 

Like people have told me before whatever decision I make, I will have to live with.

A little food for thought

www.allabouthim.com

Thank you for everyone that is posted.  I do appreciate your responses.  It sounds as if I am bringing too many of my issues to this forum, and perhaps they are the same issues time and time again. 

Thing is, this is a sign that here is something (in your life - nevermind the forum) that you need to pay attention to.  All is not well & to outsiders, it appears that has to do with your relationship with this guy in Manchester.

Obviously, take all our advice with a grain of salt, but we all wish you well.  Be kind to yourself and your daughter in your decisions, is all we are saying.

The guy doesn't sound like someone who is worthy of you, and you and your daughter deserve both better than that. 

I have some fairly controversial things to say, I hope the backlash won't be too harsh. 

Based on my experience, I'm not convinced that parents staying around to "be" with their children is always in the child's best interest.  If parents are unhappy, children feel it, and they suffer from it.  My parents didn't divorce until I was 22, but I honestly wish they would have split up ten years earlier.  They were so bitterly unhappy and unfulfilled and hated each other so much that neither I nor my brother had any kind of relationship with either of them.  What Mrs Robinson said about not knowing how to go about grownup life, that was my experience too.  My parents didn't have any friends, never socialised, rarely saw their families (because each disliked the other's family), we never did anything together as a family.  It has taken me years to learn how to form proper relationships, and my brother has still not gotten his life back on track after dropping out of high school in part because of the bitter divorce that was going on when he was 16-18.  If my mother had left when I was ten, and moved across the country the way she wanted to, I think we all would have been happier.  Yes, it would have been difficult, we wouldn't have seen either parent as much, and we may have had to choose which one we wanted to spend more time with, but I am convinced that if my parents had been happier in their own lives, then we would have been happier in ours, and that we would have been more successful in our adult lives. 

Katrinakov, if you are going to be miserable staying in the US, then your misery will affect your daughter.  You may come to resent her for keeping you from doing what you really want.  If you do decide to stay for her, then you must be perfectly content with that decision, and if you can't be content with it, then maybe you shouldn't stay.  Personally, I think that moving to be with your fiance is a mistake, but people have been telling you that for months and you haven't listened, so maybe you need to make the mistake in order to learn from it.  There will be unpleasant repercussions no matter what you decide.  You just have to weigh everything in the balance and do what you think is best for everyone involved. 

Not an easy situation Katrina, hope whatever is supposed to work out works out. Good luck 

Based on my experience, I'm not convinced that parents staying around to "be" with their children is always in the child's best interest.  If parents are unhappy, children feel it, and they suffer from it. 

I agree with this, and I agree with what vnicepeeps said about non-custodial parents.

I had a very difficult childhood and remember as a child wishing that my parents would get a divorce so I could have some peace in my life and not live under constant stress.

That being said, I don't think this is really about whether or not Katrinacov should stay with her daughter. It's about the fact that she is making the decision based on what her fiance wants, not on what she wants.

If she was considering moving to the UK and not seeing her daughter because, for example, she had a fantastic career opportunity, it would be a completely different issue.

This more about her relationship with her fiance and her reasons for wanting to be with him than about her relationship with her daughter.

I had a very difficult childhood and remember as a child wishing that my parents would get a divorce so I could have some peace in my life and not live under constant stress.

I totally agree that staying together solely for the sake of the children isn't a good idea. However, I'd still hope that both parents would be able to (and would want to) spend as much time with the children as they could - even after a divorce.

I totally agree that staying together solely for the sake of the children isn't a good idea. However, I'd still hope that both parents would be able to (and would want to) spend as much time with the children as they could - even after a divorce.

Exactly. I am so glad my parents got divorced, because now that I'm older I can clearly see how wrong they were for each other. That said, I would've been really sad not to see one of my parents again (or very rarely) just because they weren't married anymore.

My own daughter was 2 when her father and I divorced.  At that age, I'd not have wanted her traveling to another state, much less another country, for visitation.  I'd have done my best to make sure he had to come and visit her.   

He only saw her about 3 times in the next 3 years, and it really tore her up when he'd disappear.  It took a toll, and they no longer have a relationship.  She also has trust issues when it comes to men.

If you move to the UK and chose to visit, how frequently can you do so?  What other means will you use to maintain your relationship with your daughter?  At 2.5 years, they don't read or really use a telephone.  Would your ex be willing to read letters or e-mails to her?  How often do you think he would allow telephone (or Skype) calls?  The few times my ex called, I had to participate in the phone calls, because of her speech.  I also had to prompt her to say "yes" and "no," instead of nodding her head at the phone.

If your ex remarries or lives with another woman, your daughter will probably feel a bond there.  This person would have a lot of influence over your daughter--especially with you being overseas.  How well do you think you could handle this, especially from the UK.  You say your relationship with your daughter is very important to you.  She's in the years where some of the strongest bonding takes place.   

My fiance left his two daughters with his ex...they are older 11 and 12 so he explained to them that he loves them etc...and then moved over to me.  Since he has been back in the UK he hasnt seen them except on Fathers day...but they are kids so they are involved with their friends. 

He made that decision.  I never asked him to.  He just decided.  He has no visitation, and he is hurt that I haven't automatically made the same decision.  But my daughter is younger. 

It sounds like he chose to abdicate some major responsibility towards his children.  Their age and having friends is no excuse.  He could be a bigger part of their lives, and they could still see friends when it was time to be with their mother.  They might even be able to make friends in his neighborhood.  Have you considered having a child with him?  Expect the same if the relationship sours afterward.

Does he have child-support obligations?  Is he somehow honoring them without a job?  If you go over there and get a job, will your income somehow be attached to any existing obligations of that nature?  Would he expect you to use your earnings to satisfy any of these obligations?  If so, you could be struggling economically more than you expect.  If you and he have a child, and then break up, expect the same (priority, time and money) as he gives to his two current children.

Why are the 2 children this man hardly sees more precious than your daughter who you say you love and want to be with?  This situation could easily breed resentment on your part over time.

No matter where you live as a couple, someone will spend a major piece of time away from his or her children.  Who can deal with that more easily?  It doesn't sound like that person is you, but he wants you to do so.   

You have also indicated that this person has refused to take work because it was "boring."  If he wanted you with him, he'd take whatever work was available to make it happen.  Has he taken any real steps to get things set up for your arrival?  It sounds like you've made the lion's share of the effort.  Yet another piece of irresponsibility on his part.

While I understand that you have the right to pursue happiness, I don't see it happening for you with him.  He doesn't seem to be actively trying to move things forward so you can start your life as a couple together.  His disregard for one of the most meaningful things in your life (your daughter) is also deeply troubling to me.  I wish you luck peace and wisdom, but could not leave my daughter--especially with the information you've given.  I don't envy you your decision.       

Katrinakov, if you are going to be miserable staying in the US, then your misery will affect your daughter.  You may come to resent her for keeping you from doing what you really want.  If you do decide to stay for her, then you must be perfectly content with that decision, and if you can't be content with it, then maybe you shouldn't stay.  Personally, I think that moving to be with your fiance is a mistake, but people have been telling you that for months and you haven't listened, so maybe you need to make the mistake in order to learn from it.  There will be unpleasant repercussions no matter what you decide.  You just have to weigh everything in the balance and do what you think is best for everyone involved. 

Completely agree with this. The OP mentioned her ex was rather controlling when they were together. I can say the same for my father over my mother. It took a lot of courage for my mother to finally leave him (and I'm glad she did because he was toxic), but afterwards... things changed. I think she was liberated in such a way, that she began making many choices and decisions that she later regretted (and by later, I mean 20 years later when I finally pointed them out). She became very self indulgent which my sister & I paid for in the end. I recall nights of staying up waiting for her to come home, crying with worry that something had happened to her. As it turned out, she was just out with friends enjoying her freedom. I understand now why she craved that, but as a young child... I resented her for it and I think a small part of me still does. Be careful with your decisions, Katrina. Don't make your daughter pay for the sour relationship. The "ah ha" moment for you should be when you realize you can have love/happiness AND your daughter. Just maybe not with a man who makes you choose between the two.

I don't envy your situation.  I agree with what most have said here, that a man who really loves you wouldn't ask you to make such a huge sacrifice when he's done virtually nothing to help you transition over to Manchester. 

I guess part of my confusion is, if your ex-husband is such a controlling person, why did you leave your daughter in his primary custody?  You've said previously that until recently, you didn't have much contact with your daughter.  I think it's great that you want a solid relationship with your child and honestly, any man who would force you to choose him over your child is not worth having.

Men come and go.  Your daughter has one mother.  You.