Passport Versus Visa

 

I never run out of confusion over this stuff....

My 5 week old son has a long form British birth certificate.
We are going to London next week to apply for his passport.
My wife is Hungarian. We will go there in January and apply for that passport (EU).
We are planning on flying to Texas in March.

Will there be any issues coming back into England with an EU passport?
Will his passport and birth certificate suffice for entry into the UK?

I'm trying to buy some airline tickets today. Fingers crossed.

....and thanks for all the patient help.

 

Found this:
Section 4a - Children born in the United Kingdom who are not British Citizens wrote:
1. INTRODUCTION
....
This section relates to children born in the United Kingdom on or after 1 January 1983 who are not British citizens because, at the time of their birth, neither of their parents was a British citizen or settled here. Such children do not have the right of abode and are subject to immigration control. They are not here unlawfully, however, and are not required to apply for leave to remain (see ANNEX P, paragraph 11 if further guidance is required on this point)...

I guess this means they do need one without the Hungarian/EU passport. Well, if we don't have that when we return, I'll just say he's visiting for 6 months. Hell, he's got a registered address that he'll be staying at.   

My 5 week old son has a long form British birth certificate.
We are going to London next week to apply for his passport.
My wife is Hungarian. We will go there in January and apply for that passport (EU).
We are planning on flying to Texas in March.

Just to clarify:

- You are applying for a US passport for him in London
- He is not a British citizen, but is a Hungarian citizen so you will also be applying for a Hungarian passport for him as well

Will there be any issues coming back into England with an EU passport?

No, there shouldn't be, because as an EU citizen, your son will be legally allowed to live in the UK with an EU passport and will not need a visa or EEA residence card

Will his passport and birth certificate suffice for entry into the UK?

Just his EU passport should be fine. His birth certificate should not be needed as his passport will prove his citizenship.

When you travel to the US, he will need to enter and leave the US on his US passport (it's a legal requirement) and then enter and leave the UK on his EU passport.

Found this:
Section 4a - Children born in the United Kingdom who are not British Citizens wrote:
1. INTRODUCTION
....
This section relates to children born in the United Kingdom on or after 1 January 1983 who are not British citizens because, at the time of their birth, neither of their parents was a British citizen or settled here. Such children do not have the right of abode and are subject to immigration control. They are not here unlawfully, however, and are not required to apply for leave to remain (see ANNEX P, paragraph 11 if further guidance is required on this point)...

I guess this means they do need one without the Hungarian/EU passport. Well, if we don't have that when we return, I'll just say he's visiting for 6 months. Hell, he's got a registered address that he'll be staying at.   

Technically, that paragraph just applies to children whose parents are not UK or EU citizens (or do not have permanent residence in the UK). For example, if you and your wife were both US citizens and were living in the UK on work visas, then your son would have no claim to UK or EU citizenship and would need a visa to live in the UK.

However, as he is an EU citizen, you just need to apply for his EU passport and he will not need a visa. Ideally, though, you really ought to get his Hungarian passport before you leave the UK with him, so that he will not have any issues trying to re-enter the country, but if you have to leave and will be returning to the UK before you have his EU passport, then you may be okay just showing his UK birth certificate and proof of your wife's Hungarian citizenship when you re-enter the UK.

When you go to Hungary to apply for his EU passport, will you have received the passport before you travel back to the UK? If so, then there will be nothing to worry about in regards to re-entering as he will be able to show the EU passport.

Thanks for all that! Very informative indeed.

Fingers crossed for the EU passport before our return, but if not, I'm sure the British long form birth certificate and mom's EU passport will suffice. If not,then we'll just reroute to Budapest if they refuse us entry from the US.

We will be going to Hungary on the US passport first, but we are not aware that this is a problem. It's during that time that we hope to complete all the necessary requirements for our son's EU passport. Then it is just a small gamble on time.

Thanks again.

Has your wife lived in the UK for five or more years? If she has, she might be considered a permanent resident and your child could be considered a UK citizen.

My wife has been here more than 5 years, but she isn't interested in jumping through hoops and I'm not interested in my son being a UK citizen. Well, it's more like we aren't planning on staying here forever. I don't know if the benefits to that outweigh our reservations, but that's how we feel about it now, and the whole issue with the passports is solely over travel in and out of the UK.

My wife has been here more than 5 years, but she isn't interested in jumping through hoops and I'm not interested in my son being a UK citizen.

She doesn't need to jump through any hoops and I'm pretty sure your son already is a UK citizen.

After 5 years of exercising her treaty rights in the UK, your wife automatically became a UK permanent resident (she didn't have to apply for it, it's just automatic for EEA citizens). And if she was a permanent resident at the time your son was born, that means that your son is automatically a British citizen - so in fact, he should already hold US, UK and Hungarian citizenship.

So you have a choice: you can apply for just his Hungarian passport if you like, but you can also apply for a UK passport for him as well if you want to...which would prevent you from having any problems entering the UK with him in the event that you can't get his Hungarian passport in time.

My wife has been here more than 5 years, but she isn't interested in jumping through hoops and I'm not interested in my son being a UK citizen. Well, it's more like we aren't planning on staying here forever. I don't know if the benefits to that outweigh our reservations, but that's how we feel about it now, and the whole issue with the passports is solely over travel in and out of the UK.

There aren't really any downsides to having a UK passport, especially since your son is already a citizen, automatically. Event though you don't plan to stay in the UK forever, you never know what your son (or his children, since he'll be able to transfer citizenship to one generation born outside the UK) might want to do in the future. The EU might not last forever. Having the passport can't hurt.

There aren't really any downsides to having a UK passport, especially since your son is already a citizen, automatically. Event though you don't plan to stay in the UK forever, you never know what your son (or his children, since he'll be able to transfer citizenship to one generation born outside the UK) might want to do in the future. The EU might not last forever. Having the passport can't hurt.

My thoughts as well - if I had the luxury of being a citizen of 3 different countries I would definitely make the most of it and apply for all 3 passports .

My thoughts as well - if I had the luxury of being a citizen of 3 different countries I would definitely make the most of it and apply for all 3 passports .

I agree being a citizen of 3 countries would be pretty awesome!!

Maybe I'm just remembering something completely different but I thought that if you are in possession of a U.S. passport, you could only hold dual-citizenship with one other country. Therefore you would need to decide which 2 out of the 3 passports you'd want your child to hold.

I could be completely wrong on that matter, however.

Maybe I'm just remembering something completely different but I thought that if you are in possession of a U.S. passport, you could only hold dual-citizenship with one other country. Therefore you would need to decide which 2 out of the 3 passports you'd want your child to hold.

I could be completely wrong on that matter, however.

I'm pretty sure this is inaccurate. Even if it were accurate, the OP's child automatically has three citizenships by virtue of birth and it seems unfair to require a parent to make the choice for an infant, who obviously cannot make his own choice. Even countries that don't allow dual citizenship for adults, like Japan, allow it for children and require a decision about which citizenship they would like to retain in young adulthood. Other countries, like Germany, which generally don't allow dual citizenship by virtue of naturalization, DO allow it if you've acquired it by birth. 

I'm pretty sure this is inaccurate.

Yeah it is. I have known a couple of tri-citizens.

Yep, Oonablah, that is inaccurate as the others have said. Frankly, the US gov doesn't really give a damn about dual citizenship and will only treat you as an American regardless of whatever or how many other passports you hold.

I'm pretty sure this is inaccurate. Even if it were accurate, the OP's child automatically has three citizenships by virtue of birth and it seems unfair to require a parent to make the choice for an infant, who obviously cannot make his own choice. Even countries that don't allow dual citizenship for adults, like Japan, allow it for children and require a decision about which citizenship they would like to retain in young adulthood. Other countries, like Germany, which generally don't allow dual citizenship by virtue of naturalization, DO allow it if you've acquired it by birth. 

Just a funny fact to add about Japanese dual citizenship. I know the dual citizenship laws for Japan say that you must relinquish any other passport in order to maintain Japanese nationality by the age of 22 in the case of children. However, dual American/Japanese citizens have found a loophole in maintaining both. They inform the US authorities that they wish to keep their US passports and the Japanese authorities are trying to force them to relinquish their US citizenship. Since the US does not recognize another entity forcing an American to give up their US citizenship, they still remain US citizens. On the embassy website, I found it saying *somewhere* for US citizens to just ignore letters from Japanese authorities to relinquish US citizenship. Meanwhile, they just keep renewing their Japanese passports...

Maybe I'm just remembering something completely different but I thought that if you are in possession of a U.S. passport, you could only hold dual-citizenship with one other country. Therefore you would need to decide which 2 out of the 3 passports you'd want your child to hold.

I could be completely wrong on that matter, however.

It is inaccurate...just ask Transpondia, his child is a Tri National.