From Princeton to London II - Finding Lodging

Hello all,
I'm in the process of planning to move to the U.K., with a particular interest in the London area (due to higher availability of jobs). I'll be able to work, as I'll have an EEA Family permit, and will apply for a Residence Card on arrival.

At this point, I'm navigating the woes of trying assess the neighborhoods in London. I'm looking for an area that's meets my needs in terms of family life, safety, culture, price, and accessibility. I'll be moving with my wife and 7 year old child, so it has to be a family friendly and SAFE neighborhood. We won't have a car, so it has to be accessible. As far as culture goes, coming from the Princeton area in the U.S., we'd like to have access to museums, restaurants, etc. And since we won't have a car, it has to be accessible by public transport to wherever I work, as well as amenities like grocery stores, etc. And finally, I'd like to stick with a monthly rent of about £1200, for a 2 bedroom.

Where can I look that would meet all these criteria?
Are there reputable agencies to work with that may be able to assist?
What are typical requirements for leasing or renting a property in the U.K.?


Also, I'd like to stay in temporary short term lodging (1-3 weeks) while we get the "lay of the land" and actually visit neighborhoods ourselves. Are there hostels that
are family friendly? Or are they mostly filled with traveling university students?


Thanks!

Moved this from the other post:

Well, it depends on the job you want to be honest, you'd be surprised how difficult it is to get a job in London at the moment. But aside from that bit of pessimism, London has so many places that are great. I live in a suburb in West London that is slowly growing (Hanwell) and is pretty family friendly. It is also close to most forms of major transportation, including Heathrow.

The east and south/east (Shoreditch, Bethnal Green, Camberwell, Peckham, Brockley, Dulwich, Brixton, Streatham, etc) are all up and comers and would probably be in your price point. They are also gentrifying quickly, so there are hip cafes, restaurants, shops, cinemas, urban farms and places for families to grow. Unless you're in zone 5 or up, anywhere you are you'll be able to go to museums without much hassle. I live in zone 4 and I go to museums all the time, especially since there are museums, historical properties and points of interest all over the city, not just in central London (for example, I live next to a canal, 3 parks and also live close to Ealing Broadway, Chiswick, Kew Gardens and Richmond Park)

The London Overground has also made it easier to get around in more of the outer areas in the southeast, though most Londoners deal with long commutes to work and play. It's just a fact of life that it will take you ages to get from one place to another unless you tend to not leave your area. I haven't driven a car in the six years I've been here, and my husband only drives if we're going on holiday to the countryside. You don't need to own a car in London, and there are even car share organisations if you find that you need one for a big shop or an Ikea run.

London (like the majority of England) on the whole is safe, safer than most cities in the US I would say. But unless you live in a place like Chelsea or Mayfair, there will be a mix of poor and middle class people, which I find fantastic and a big change from the US. I also think that if you don't go looking for trouble, most likely trouble will not find you. I've never really had any issues while living here, and I've lived/hung out in places like New Cross (which I would love to move back to) and Peckham, which have bad reputations (though both are gentrifying rapidly).

I can't help so much on property search, since I lucked into my current place, but friends have used Zoopla, Right Move, Gumtree in some cases, and there are newspapers with property sections as well. I know I’m missing some big ones, so hopefully other people will be able to help with that. In my experience, hostels tend to be student-catered, but a google search led to London House Hotel in Notting Hill. It seems a bit expensive though, now that I've looked at it.

Hope this helps a bit!

Moved this from the other post:

Well, it depends on the job you want to be honest, you'd be surprised how difficult it is to get a job in London at the moment. But aside from that bit of pessimism, London has so many places that are great. I live in a suburb in West London that is slowly growing (Hanwell) and is pretty family friendly. It is also close to most forms of major transportation, including Heathrow.

The east and south/east (Shoreditch, Bethnal Green, Camberwell, Peckham, Brockley, Dulwich, Brixton, Streatham, etc) are all up and comers and would probably be in your price point. They are also gentrifying quickly, so there are hip cafes, restaurants, shops, cinemas, urban farms and places for families to grow. Unless you're in zone 5 or up, anywhere you are you'll be able to go to museums without much hassle. I live in zone 4 and I go to museums all the time, especially since there are museums, historical properties and points of interest all over the city, not just in central London (for example, I live next to a canal, 3 parks and also live close to Ealing Broadway, Chiswick, Kew Gardens and Richmond Park)

I'm sorry but I must say that I would not recommend much of the East or South-East for newly arrived families. Yes they are gentrifying, but those areas have some of the most crime in all of London... Greenwich is nice though (zones 2 and 3) and might be in your price point.

They're not going to live in a council estate, they're going to live in a small house or decent flat. Greenwich would be too expensive for them, but a place like Brockley (which is nice, has restaurants, transport and loads of family stuff) would be within their price point. I've lived in the southeast and have friends who live in both the east and southeast and have somehow managed to not encounter crime. You can't just say two entire areas of London are dangerous and crime-filled, it's inaccurate and a bit insulting. I would love to be back in a place like New Cross or Brockley and it's where my husband and I are looking to settle down, along with my friends- many who are in new homes and are starting families. Like I said before, the crime rate in London in comparison to most cities in the US is low, and crimes tend to be concentrated in certain areas, within gangs and people who live in more deprived areas. Most likely, they won't be in those places and will have nothing to worry about. I stand by my recommendations, they can always move someplace else once they've settled a bit if they don't like it.

I have to agree with RAR, moving to some of the the up and coming neighborhoods mentioned might be a bit too much culture shock. I also agree w CoV that some of these areas are more affordable and hence why young families will do well there, however personally I'd move there after getting the proper lay of the land. I can see how someone coming from Princeton might find Peckham to be scary. And the last time DH and I went looking around Bethnal Green for nice looking 2 bed flats we were shocked at the prices; it's way past up and coming.

To the OP: for your £1200 budget you are should be looking in areas that are in zone 4 and up, likely on the outskirts of big transportation hubs; areas that immediately jump out at me are Kingston, Enfield, *maybe* at a stretch Ealing, with a focus on West and South Ealing. I just did a basic search in West London on Right Move at a max price of £1250pcm and came up with some nice looking properties in Hanwell so CoV is on the ball with that one. Going east you can look into Walthamstow, I've heard nice things about Walthamstow Village and its cute shops and pubs. Going south, you could do worse than look in some of the areas around Crystal Palace (like Sydenham, Forest Hill and West Norwood) and Wimbeldon, like this place in Raynes Park: http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-to-rent/property-40956662.html?premiumA=true

Quick reminder to not forget about council tax; it is not included in your rent and for a 2 bed place I'd expect to be paying between £100-150/month in addition to your rental costs. Ask your estate agent what the costs are and then double check with the council because estate agents may not know what they are talking about.

I'm sure you've already spent some time reading the many posts on what the process is and requirements are for renting in the UK, and specifically London. I can sum it up for you best that when you arrive, you should register with the estate agents in the areas you want to live. Yes, they do list on websites like Right Move and Findaproperty and the rest, however they are notoriously slow at replacing their stock online and often times leave excellent properties listed to lure potential tenants in. Plus they'd rather deal with you whilst you are in the country with a solid move in date. Such is the system.

You may also find that there aren't many properties that are available immediately. Notice periods in the UK are 2 months, and this allows the landlord to get their property marketed and rented out at least a month in advance. Giving yourselves 3 weeks in short term accommodation is wise. Financially, expect to pay first month plus 6 weeks deposit, and each estate agent has their own structure for nonrefundable admin fees etc so set aside at least £250 for that.

If you want to avoid the entire estate agent thing, Gumtree has a "private seller" option in its rental search. A lot of us here on UK-Y have found rentals this way. Since the landlord doesn't have to pay fees to the estate agent, the savings ideally get passed on to you. That may open up your search area.

Re short term accom: Hostels... not so much. I've stayed in a few London hostels in my time and the YHA in Holland Park is family friendly (or at least was ten years ago) but has a time limit on how long you can stay. Most of the hostels are for backpackers and students. I'd mostly avoid. There are a lot of self catering studios and the like around Bayswater. You could try airbnb for flat rentals or get in touch with Foxtons - they have rather cornered the market in short term accommodation. Also there's the option of looking for holiday lets or with corporate housing communities like Oakwood. But like most things in London, they are not inexpensive.

I hope this post has been helpful. It's definitely been long! 

They're not going to live in a council estate, they're going to live in a small house or decent flat. Greenwich would be too expensive for them, but a place like Brockley (which is nice, has restaurants, transport and loads of family stuff) would be within their price point. The crime rate in London in comparison to most cities in the US is low, and crimes tend to be concentrated in certain areas, within gangs and people who live in more deprived areas. Most likely, they won't be in those places and will have nothing to worry about.

I stand by my post and I did not as you said paint two entire areas as crime-filled. I said I would not recommend much of the South-East and East. I recommended Greenwich, which is SE. Maybe the OP can't afford Cutty Sark but we got a nice large house in Charlton (in Greenwich borough) for about that amount per month.  

The OP said 'SAFE' in bold letters and a few of the areas you recommended (Peckham, Brixton or Southwark borough, Dulwich, Lewisham borough) have some of the highest crime rates in London (outside of central London) and in Lewisham's case the highest rate of knife crime in the whole country according to the Metropolitan police. How was my former post inaccurate?

I've lived in the southeast and have friends who live in both the east and southeast and have somehow managed to not encounter crime.

I envy you. I have lived in the southeast too and have friends who have lived in E and SE. The OP asked for opinions and my experiences in those areas were not as peaceful and safe as yours. If I were moving my family to London, I would not move them there because of my experiences--for the same reason, I don't recommend it to the OP.

Yes, crime happens everywhere. My city in the US has high crime too, but I lived in a nicer area. So to move from a low-crime area to a place with high crime stats is a shocker, no matter the overall statistics of the UK having less crime than the US.

I stand by my post and I did not as you said paint two entire areas as crime-filled. I said I would not recommend much of the South-East and East. I recommended Greenwich, which is SE. Maybe the OP can't afford Cutty Sark but we got a nice large house in Charlton (in Greenwich borough) for about that amount per month.  

The OP said 'SAFE' in bold letters and a few of the areas you recommended (Peckham, Brixton or Southwark borough, Dulwich, Lewisham borough) have some of the highest crime rates in London (outside of central London) and in Lewisham's case the highest rate of knife crime in the whole country according to the Metropolitan police. How was my former post inaccurate?

Yes, these places may have areas with high crime rates, but Southwark also has places like Borough and other affluent areas, same with Lewisham. Fair enough, it may be a shock to go to Peckham or Brixton (depending on your culture), but there are places in Southwark, Lewisham and all over the east and south that are just as lovely and safe as Greenwich with a vibrant, inexpensive scene for young families. And I don't think that the OP should disregard them automatically. Obviously, they should do their research, but they are good options to consider, especially when they will have to deal with council tax and utilities on top of their rent, childcare and all the other London expenses.

And yes dels, Bethnal Green is probably too ritzy now , I just remembered how much my friend's flat cost (and there is only a tiny garden!) and my eyes watered a bit. Nice place, though- great shops and bakeries!

Also, another recommendation- South Ealing and Brentford are nice, (though I'm not sure of the rent in those areas, they might push the rent limits) Brentford also has a train straight to Waterloo.There's an independent cinema/restaurant in the area, along with a canal and river, it's more like a village than the city at that point. There are so many great places around the city to consider, though I imagine you would also want to consider things like neighbourhood schools as well!

I very much appreciate everyone's feedback and (especially!) candor.

Bear in mind: I'm no stranger to crime-ridden areas. I grew up in the very metropolitan Newark, NJ; and can tell you all there is to know about the ups and downs of every neighborhood and borough in New York. I've experienced unwanted brushes with gang activity, and know how ugly things can get. But now that I've a wife and child to look out for, I want to stay away from as much of that as possible, hence my stress on the importance of safety.

And please folks, if you think I need to loosen the purse strings a little when it comes to my budget, let me know. If an additional £250 - £300 per month makes a huge difference, I'd like to know. Also, if anyone has any good recommendations on letting agents, I'd love to hear.

Once again, I appreciate all your input!

Your budget, even with an additional £250-300/month is going to limit you to Zone 3-4 and beyond. 

Estate agents are very neighborhood specific.  You need to decide on a neighborhood first and then see which agents are in that neighborhood. 

And please folks, if you think I need to loosen the purse strings a little when it comes to my budget, let me know. If an additional £250 - £300 per month makes a huge difference, I'd like to know.

If your budget can stretch to 1500pcm, then you can probably start looking around Ealing proper, maybe Wimbledon and other zone 3/4 villages like Richmond, Kew, Twickenham (St Margaret's is lovely). All of these are very family friendly areas with excellent transport links (Richmond has an express service into Waterloo). And with the river right there, it's very scenic - though keep an ear out for the flight path.

You could also focus your search in N London around Crouch End, another bustling villagey area with good transport links to town. I have a friend who recently owned a 2 bed flat in Crouch End and he was renting it out for £1350/month. Nearby Muswell Hill is another family favorite. Can't really give you with confidence the rental costs, but it can't hurt to look.

Basically, 1500 puts you in good 2bed range but I would still expect to have to make some sort of compromise, either on proximity to public transport, quality of furnishings, lack of outdoor space or a smaller 2nd bedroom <-- this happens a lot.

I should mention at this point that if you plan on letting a flat w/o enough income, you may need to have 6 months of rent handy to put down up front. We went through this when we stretched our budget higher than estate agents would comfortably let to us. In the end that's why we went with a private landlord.