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I didn't live all that far from Karu.  Same province, different region.  I love Finland as well.  Mr. A. has promised me that we will move there someday.

He started in Kuru, at forestry college. He also did a semester of university in Turku, and lived in and around Tampere at various times. He worked for a summer at his girlfriend-at-the-time's family's strawberry farm. Put all together he lived there about a year or a little more. He ADORES it.

It is a really wonderful place.  I've been 3 times and am going again for this New Year.  I spent time in Helsinki, Haapamaki and Jyvaskyla the first time, then up in Lapland at a resort called Phya, and the third time to Turku.  It's a really beautiful place, the people are really friendly, and it's the only place I've been where you can look up at the night sky and actually see the Milky Way.  We're going to Kuusamo for New Year, and I'm really looking forward to it.

I have a deal with Gary that I'll live in Finland for a few years if he agrees to live in Burgundy for a few years! He also said he'd take Sweden, as it's at least closer to Finland.

ETA: We're going to try to take a holiday there in 2010. I've only been once, but it was only 4 days in Turku and we stayed with a friend who had cats. I'm violently allergic to cats and couldn't breathe properly except in the sauna. Took me 2 months to fully recover from the subsequent bronchitis.

If you guys are ever in London, there's a Scandinavian restaurant/grocery that sells a lot of Finnish goods (as well as other Scandinavian stuff).  It's sort of near the American consulate and is called "Scandinavian Kitchen".  They also do traditional Scandinavian coffee and snacks (but heavier on the Swedish than the other countries' cuisines).  

When you visit Finland next, have a karjalanpiirakka for me.  I miss those so much, and they will definitely be one of the first things I have when I visit. :p  Stodgey but oh so awesome.

Will do, and thanks for the tip. I'm a big fan of juustoleipa and am very much looking forward to having that again!

Heh. Talk about spelling issues when you're writing Finnish! I would love to go there one day and even learn the language! The fact that it's so different is fascinating! Camoscato, what a fun thing to do for New Year's !!

If you guys are ever in London, there's a Scandinavian restaurant/grocery that sells a lot of Finnish goods (as well as other Scandinavian stuff).  It's sort of near the American consulate and is called "Scandinavian Kitchen".  They also do traditional Scandinavian coffee and snacks (but heavier on the Swedish than the other countries' cuisines).  

One of my best friends lives in Wales and is married to a Swedish man. I just texted her to see if she knew about Scandinavian Kitchen and her response was, "Just sitting there now having lunch!" I didn't even know she was in London today! 

How does immersion work?  I took french in high school where they taught us each word one by one, how to form sentences, etc etc.  But if you are given no point of reference when people are talking at you in a language you dont know... how do you end up picking it up?

You have to study as well, but the point of immersion is that you're forced to use what you learn on a daily basis, unlike weekly classes or studying in your own time.

How does immersion work?  I took french in high school where they taught us each word one by one, how to form sentences, etc etc.  But if you are given no point of reference when people are talking at you in a language you dont know... how do you end up picking it up?

There's immersion where school is totally taught in that language with students sometimes speaking native languages outside of class and then there's just going to the culture and surrounding yourself with it.  The latter is what I am talking about when I talk about immersion.

You learn some of it through actually learning vocabulary and grammar formally, but when you are surrounded by a language and have to rely upon it to communicate, things move a lot faster.  It becomes a bit like learning your native tongue where you pick up meanings, grammar, and nuances of meaning through context.  Someone learning through immersion will probably never get to a point where they do not have to look things up, but it gets easier after the first month or so.

If people are interested in reading a fictionalised account of someone going through immersion in English, I'd suggest A Concise Chinese English Dictionary for Lovers.  It annoys some people, but I swear I remember reading that it was either based on the writer's own experience or she started it when she couldn't speak English very well.  What comes off as pigeon English is realistically how a Chinese person may view English as they start to learn (some truth in the stereotype thing).  It's not a bad book, but a bit disturbing at parts.

One of my best friends lives in Wales and is married to a Swedish man. I just texted her to see if she knew about Scandinavian Kitchen and her response was, "Just sitting there now having lunch!" I didn't even know she was in London today! 

Weird, but cool coincidence.  I love that place though.

How does immersion work?  I took french in high school where they taught us each word one by one, how to form sentences, etc etc.  But if you are given no point of reference when people are talking at you in a language you dont know... how do you end up picking it up?

You just jump right in...

I did an immersion of sorts when I lived in Ukraine at age 25. No one there spoke English except one and it was basic at best so I went speaking no Russian or Ukrainian and after a couple of weeks was able to understand quite a bit and after a few months was able to hold conversations in Russian. It's been 10 years since I've been there and I can still pick up words and phrases and can still speak a bit, but I've lost most of it.

I took 4 years french in High School (from 13 to 17 years old) and was fully fluent by the end of it. I've lost a bit over the years and wouldn't consider myself fluent anylonger but I know enough and if conversing with someone in French it amazes me how much I actually do remember. Now if I can only get to France someday.

My Grandmother & Mom spoke a dialect of German called Svebish (low German) and they would often speak it together when they didn't want myself & my cousins to know what they were discussing. But little did they know I was the only one that could understand it! But my grandmother died in 1995, so my mom doesn't speak it anymore. But, when I hear German I still can get the gist of the conversation.

I think when it comes to learning languages the earlier you start the better. I speak French to my daughter for 2 hours a day, every day since the day she was born. She looks at me and responds like she understands it, but hasn't yet tried to say anything. But she is barely speaking English here and there so it may be sometime.

Ikea does/did Swedish or maybe it was Scandinavian food at the check out. Not sure what they have.

Only the best meatballs known to man!

Ikea does/did Swedish or maybe it was Scandinavian food at the check out. Not sure what they have.

Yeah they do do some Swedish food, but it's limited and very Swedish focused.  It's good for crispbreads, some candies, and some jams, but you miss out on a lot of stuff.  And of course, their restaurant does the meatballs and potatoes (which is actually served a lot in Scandinavia with slightly different recipes depending on where you are).

WebyJ, my brother-in-law did some training in Russian (and later Ukrainian) through stuff like Earworm and Rosetta Stone, but he claims he's nearly fluent with a few trips there.  To me, that is incredible, because Russian and Ukrainian seem extremely challenging.  I think it has more to do with them being open to people using their language, because he claims that no one ever asks him where he was from or seem to react to his accent at all.  I may be totally wrong about how they view their language, but I really doubt that my BiL has picked up nearly flawless Ukrainian or Russian (I don't know which he uses when he visits) in his 40s.  He's not really a boaster or a liar either, so there has to be something to it.

As for losing Ukrainian, I know some people have fallen back into a language very quickly after being away.  I am hoping that happens with me with Finnish. Even when I start reading a bit of Finnish it starts to come back (although listening less so).  Maybe if my BiL gets his woman over here, we could set up something where she helps you pick it back up.  

When you say you were fluent, chary and WebyJ, what do you mean by that?  I mean, how would you define the term?