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Topic: I have tax questions. Please help  (Read 5517 times)

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I have tax questions. Please help
« on: March 03, 2013, 03:32:33 AM »
I'm a US citizen and my wife's a UK citizen. I am moving to Uk by the end of March 2013. I know i have to have an ITIN number for my wife therefore I have prepared 2012 taxes jointly with my wife.  However I did not e-file or mail my tax docs to IRS yet because I don't have my wife's passport or a certified copy of it. When I asked the person who prepared my taxes, she said it's best that when I go to England I get a certified copy of my wife's passport and mail everything to Texas to get an ITIN number. Once she has an ITIN number then they will go ahead and send the refund check to me.  Please tell me if this is the correct way to go about it.

Also, the same lady who prepared my taxes told me that while living and working in UK, I don't have to file taxes unless I work for the US govt. or an American company. I read ont this site that, as an American citizen, one must disclose any money equivelant to $10k and file taxes each year or at least. Something of that nature. IRS is one entity I do not want to mess with so please someone advice me. Thank you in advance.


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Re: I have tax questions. Please help
« Reply #1 on: March 03, 2013, 09:01:29 AM »
Get another person to prepare your taxes. This one is likely to land you in trouble.

This is the quick and dirty, but be aware that this does NOT cover any and all of the forms, filings etc.

 -If you meet filing thresholds, as a US citizen, you must file a return no matter where you live. You may or may not owe tax depending on your specific situation.
- If you have signature authority over a foreign financial account (typically a bank account, for most of us, but there are many 'accounts' that fall under this requirement), and at ANY time during the year the value of the account(s) is $10,000 or more, then you have to file another form with the Treasury Department.
-Read this for info about getting an ITIN:
http://www.irs.gov/Individuals/General-ITIN-Information
and note this: When should I apply for an ITIN?
You should complete Form W-7 as soon as you are ready to file your federal income tax return, since you need to attach the return to your application.


Whoever does your taxes MAY be ok for simple stuff in the US, but definitely has already given you some incorrect advice.
Married December 1992 (my 'old flame' whom I first met in the mid-70s)
1st move to UK - 1993 (Letter of Consent granted at British Embassy in Washington DC)
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Returned to UK July 2011 (Spousal Visa/KOL endorsement)
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Re: I have tax questions. Please help
« Reply #2 on: March 03, 2013, 02:02:16 PM »
Why do you have to get an ITIN for your wife? You can file married filing separately, and then none of your wife's finances have to come into play at all. And vadio is right, you absolutely have to file no matter who employs you if you earn over the threshold or meet any of the requirements for filing.
Arrived as student 9/2003; Renewed student visa 9/2006; Applied for HSMP approval 1/2008; HSMP approved 3/2008; Tier 1 General FLR received 4/2008; FLR(M) Unmarried partner approved (in-person) 27/8/2009; ILR granted at in-person PEO appointment 1/8/2011; Applied for citizenship at Edinburgh NCS 31/10/2011; Citizenship approval received 4/2/2012
FINALLY A CITIZEN! 29/2/2012


Re: I have tax questions. Please help
« Reply #3 on: March 03, 2013, 07:31:08 PM »
Why do you have to get an ITIN for your wife? You can file married filing separately, and then none of your wife's finances have to come into play at all. And vadio is right, you absolutely have to file no matter who employs you if you earn over the threshold or meet any of the requirements for filing.

I'm guessing it's because he's trying to take advantage of a refund only available if you're registering as married filling jointly.
We're actually eligible for a substantial refund on Student loan interest if we did MFJ which isn't available if we do MFS however, if when we looked into it, it turned out that if you get an ITIN and do MFJ just once then you always have to file taxes from then on O_O

I really REALLY didn't want to ever file US taxes and I particularly didn't want to be stuck filling them forever,  so we decided to forgo the short term gain of refunds if we did MFJ and do MFS so my finances never come into it.



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Re: I have tax questions. Please help
« Reply #4 on: March 03, 2013, 07:46:57 PM »
I'm guessing it's because he's trying to take advantage of a refund only available if you're registering as married filling jointly.
We're actually eligible for a substantial refund on Student loan interest if we did MFJ which isn't available if we do MFS however, if when we looked into it, it turned out that if you get an ITIN and do MFJ just once then you always have to file taxes from then on O_O

I really REALLY didn't want to ever file US taxes and I particularly didn't want to be stuck filling them forever,  so we decided to forgo the short term gain of refunds if we did MFJ and do MFS so my finances never come into it.


Woah..i litterally had to scratch my head about all this info.
And about this person who did my taxes I take it she's good for simple stuff not complex situations as in expat taxes etc. i am entitle to some refund for 2012. But I've only prepared my taxes for 2012 so far. I have not sent them in to the ITIN DEPT OR IRIS. Shall I go ahead and have them redone again and then do the W-7 form? I was on the IRS site last night after posting my ?s and found out I could go to a so called 'attaché center' in London and take my wife and her passport and my prepared tax docs along with signed W-7 and apply in person or I will have to mail all this to the Austin, TX office.

And yes, I did file MFJ. Is it better to do this or MFS? Please fellas help out as you have in my last questions.

Oh and another thing when we disclose FBAR, is it separate from federal income tax or together? And do we have to pay a separate tax on our foreign accounts or is it just a way for IRS to know about our Moneys?

Thanks you all


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Re: I have tax questions. Please help
« Reply #5 on: March 03, 2013, 08:18:11 PM »

And yes, I did file MFJ. Is it better to do this or MFS? Please fellas help out as you have in my last questions.

Oh and another thing when we disclose FBAR, is it separate from federal income tax or together? And do we have to pay a separate tax on our foreign accounts or is it just a way for IRS to know about our Moneys?

Thanks you all

If you were preparing your own taxes you could quickly see, with a few clicks, how much extra tax you would pay.  You could ask your tax preparer this question - only took me 5 minutes to run TurboTax and change the filing status to see the difference it makes. I just went into my return for 2012 and changed from MFJ to MFS, and the difference was $1,448 additional tax due, and that would be with my wife living with me all year, earning no income and not filing herself - that means I can still claim her as a dependent.  

If you have a foreign bank account which had more than $10,000 at any point during the year you have to report it on your tax return but you do not pay tax on the money in the account, only on any interest it generates during the year.  There is a form (TD F 90-22.1) that you have to fill in and mail off to an office in Detroit that simply lists the name of each bank and account that you have and say what the highest sum you had during the year.  (I pick the highest balance from my monthly bank statements, using the exchange rate of the day to convert to $).

Unless you have a lot of money in foreign accounts ( >$100,000) then FBAR does not apply.

PS

When filing MFS, and claiming your wife as a dependent it will ask for her SSN or ITIN, so maybe you can't claim her if she is not a permanent residence with an ITIN.  If I don't claim my wife then my tax bill goes up by $2,386.



« Last Edit: March 03, 2013, 08:27:35 PM by durhamlad »
Dual USC/UKC living in the UK since May 2016


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Re: I have tax questions. Please help
« Reply #6 on: March 03, 2013, 08:38:04 PM »
If you were preparing your own taxes you could quickly see, with a few clicks, how much extra tax you would pay.  You could ask your tax preparer this question - only took me 5 minutes to run TurboTax and change the filing status to see the difference it makes. I just went into my return for 2012 and changed from MFJ to MFS, and the difference was $1,448 additional tax due, and that would be with my wife living with me all year, earning no income and not filing herself - that means I can still claim her as a dependent.  

If you have a foreign bank account which had more than $10,000 at any point during the year you have to report it on your tax return but you do not pay tax on the money in the account, only on any interest it generates during the year.  There is a form (TD F 90-22.1) that you have to fill in and mail off to an office in Detroit that simply lists the name of each bank and account that you have and say what the highest sum you had during the year.  (I pick the highest balance from my monthly bank statements, using the exchange rate of the day to convert to $).

Unless you have a lot of money in foreign accounts ( >$100,000) then FBAR does not apply.

PS

When filing MFS, and claiming your wife as a dependent it will ask for her SSN or ITIN, so maybe you can't claim her if she is not a permanent residence with an ITIN.  If I don't claim my wife then my tax bill goes up by $2,386.




First off Thanks durhamlad.
Secondly is it normal if with every answer i get here i get more questions pop up? I dont wanna be an annoying guy....you said at anytime if one has $10000 in one's account then you have to show that on your income tax. You wont be taxed unless you earned interest etc on those accounts....what if my personal account reaches $10k limit after I've filed my year end taxes then would i have to amend those taxes. If so, then thats a headache because if that happened every year id be amending every year. From what i read on IRS OR DEPT OF TREASURY site that once you have reached $10k limit you have until June 30th of the following year to disclose that to dept. of Treasury.
I do have property in California and i have been claiming interest paid on it and property tax every year i file taxes. While living abroad can i still claim the interest paid on my property and property tax and as a Californian we have to file year end state tax (franchise tax board) too. Will i have to continue that while living in UK?
And how can i keep my wife's finances out of this whole mess (if you can call it) if she's a UK citizen.

Ps ive read on IRS site that anyone can have an ITIN if they pay taxes in US even they they are not a legal resident of the US or its common wealth..


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Re: I have tax questions. Please help
« Reply #7 on: March 03, 2013, 08:56:50 PM »
And how can i keep my wife's finances out of this whole mess (if you can call it) if she's a UK citizen.

As I understand it, you just file 'Married, Filing Separately' and put NRA (Non-Resident Alien) in the box that asks for her SSN. Then you include only your financial details and leave her details out of it.


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Re: I have tax questions. Please help
« Reply #8 on: March 03, 2013, 09:21:15 PM »
If you have a foreign bank account which had more than $10,000 at any point during the year you have to report it on your tax return but you do not pay tax on the money in the account, only on any interest it generates during the year.
It's not just one account over $10,000. If the highest balance of all foreign accounts, when added together, totals over $10,000, then an FBAR is required. So, three accounts with a valuation of $3,500 in each will require the completion of an FBAR.
 
Unless you have a lot of money in foreign accounts ( >$100,000) then FBAR does not apply.
I think a typo may have snuck in here. I think you meant to refer to FATCA Form 8938, not FBAR. The figure given is the end of year total for someone filing jointly whilst resident in the US, for form 8938. The figure varies according to filing status, highest balance during the year, and residence (US or abroad).


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Re: I have tax questions. Please help
« Reply #9 on: March 03, 2013, 09:24:42 PM »
First off Thanks durhamlad.
Secondly is it normal if with every answer i get here i get more questions pop up? I dont wanna be an annoying guy....you said at anytime if one has $10000 in one's account then you have to show that on your income tax. You wont be taxed unless you earned interest etc on those accounts....what if my personal account reaches $10k limit after I've filed my year end taxes then would i have to amend those taxes. If so, then thats a headache because if that happened every year id be amending every year. From what i read on IRS OR DEPT OF TREASURY site that once you have reached $10k limit you have until June 30th of the following year to disclose that to dept. of Treasury.
I do have property in California and i have been claiming interest paid on it and property tax every year i file taxes. While living abroad can i still claim the interest paid on my property and property tax and as a Californian we have to file year end state tax (franchise tax board) too. Will i have to continue that while living in UK?
And how can i keep my wife's finances out of this whole mess (if you can call it) if she's a UK citizen.

Ps ive read on IRS site that anyone can have an ITIN if they pay taxes in US even they they are not a legal resident of the US or its common wealth..

First of all, as Ksand says, you can put NRA (Non Resident Alien) on the form where it asks for an ITIN or SSN.

Regardless of how much you have in a bank account in the UK you should be reporting the interest you have received on your US tax return as US citizens are taxed on their world wide income.  

The $10k issue is simply a reporting issue, with that form TD F 90, and as you say, plenty of time to mail it off.

While living in the UK you should still be filing US taxes and can claim the interest on your property as you have been doing on your Federal return.  I have no idea about the California State tax situation for US citizens living abroad.
Dual USC/UKC living in the UK since May 2016


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Re: I have tax questions. Please help
« Reply #10 on: March 03, 2013, 09:25:50 PM »
It's not just one account over $10,000. If the highest balance of all foreign accounts, when added together, totals over $10,000, then an FBAR is required. So, three accounts with a valuation of $3,500 in each will require the completion of an FBAR.
 I think a typo may have snuck in here. I think you meant to refer to FATCA Form 8938, not FBAR. The figure given is the end of year total for someone filing jointly whilst resident in the US, for form 8938. The figure varies according to filing status, highest balance during the year, and residence (US or abroad).

Correct - my mistake - thanks.
Dual USC/UKC living in the UK since May 2016


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Re: I have tax questions. Please help
« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2013, 09:37:48 PM »
you said at anytime if one has $10000 in one's account then you have to show that on your income tax. You wont be taxed unless you earned interest etc on those accounts....what if my personal account reaches $10k limit after I've filed my year end taxes then would i have to amend those taxes. If so, then thats a headache because if that happened every year id be amending every year. From what i read on IRS OR DEPT OF TREASURY site that once you have reached $10k limit you have until June 30th of the following year to disclose that to dept. of Treasury.
The FBAR covers the same period as your tax return, 1 January to 31 December.

If you are resident outside the US on April 15, you have until 15 June to file your 1040. You have until 30 June to file your FBAR no matter where you live.

For US tax year 20XX, you file your taxes prior to 15 June of the following year for the 20XX tax return, and by 30 June, you file your FBAR for 20XX.


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Re: I have tax questions. Please help
« Reply #12 on: March 03, 2013, 10:04:48 PM »
I do have property in California and i have been claiming interest paid on it and property tax every year i file taxes.
Dependent on your filing status in the UK (that's residence status, not marital status), if you retain the property in California, you may have to file a UK Self Assessment tax return.


......and as a Californian we have to file year end state tax (franchise tax board) too. Will i have to continue that while living in UK?
If you're referring to retaining the California property whilst resident in the UK: Being that it's California, my guess would be it's a certainty. I could be wrong. You'll want to do some research.


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Re: I have tax questions. Please help
« Reply #13 on: March 03, 2013, 10:16:53 PM »
FYI, we haven't set foot in Louisiana in 3 years, or own any property there, but because I have a pension paid by a Louisiana company I have to pay Louisiana taxes, and that will be the same when we move back to the UK.  Being non-resident and not eligible to vote means nothing.  I complete a State W4 to claim maximum allowances but the taxes withheld each year are several hundred $ more than I owe so I always have to file to claim a refund.
Dual USC/UKC living in the UK since May 2016


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Re: I have tax questions. Please help
« Reply #14 on: March 03, 2013, 10:54:39 PM »
Thanks all. I appreciate thsese answers. Now at least I have an idea what my situation is so I will do a bit more through research on tax issues. Again thanks a lot.


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