Do you LOVE the UK compared to USA, or is life keeping you here?

I am glad I'm not the parent of a young child here, really. (It's tough enough being the parent of an adult child.)

I really worry about UK education!! Having been in that system (from a teaching perspective), I can’t say I believe in it, at all!!! Not that we could afford to send her to the same sort of schools I went to and so we won’t have much choice. I think that’s my biggest sadness at the moment. She will have nowhere near the opportunities and choices I did. By some measures of parenting, I’ve failed before I’ve even begun!!

But I digress. Nothing about that stuff has owt to do with leaving the EU, just the generally low wages in the UK!


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The Tory lunge to the right is disconcerting to say the least. Dark times ahead.

I'm most concerned about things not mentioned in this post, losing protections afforded by being a member of the EU and the government needing to abide by them. I understand for some businesses they were a headache, but from a consumer safety and food standards point of view they are needed. And from a human rights angle, entirely responsible for keeping the UK accountable. I have no faith in the current government doing anything to protect or improve life for the vulnerable in society, and EU investment has kept many of the towns that voted for Brexit afloat. I'm very pessimistic about it all, but losing the ability to move to Europe wasn't at the top of my concerns.

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I really worry about UK education!! Having been in that system (from a teaching perspective), I can’t say I believe in it, at all!!! Not that we could afford to send her to the same sort of schools I went to and so we won’t have much choice. I think that’s my biggest sadness at the moment. She will have nowhere near the opportunities and choices I did. By some measures of parenting, I’ve failed before I’ve even begun!!

But I digress. Nothing about that stuff has owt to do with leaving the EU, just the generally low wages in the UK!


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Do you have the option to home school? When the Daughter was little, we were in California, which at that time had public schools ranked #49 out of 50, in the country, with #1 being the best. I was fortunate to be in a teacher education program at the time, so I kept my books and materials, and for most of her life she got a curriculum outside that which they gave her in the various public school systems. (Which was usually several years below her functional level.) Between the two sources, and liberal visits to the library as "a treat", and her having a really good set of brain cells, she got a decent education. There's no reason to leave it just to the schools.... 

You all gave some very open and helpful assessments of how your life has measured up since living in the UK and I appreciate your experiences a great deal. A lot of people don't fully understand the courage and commitment it requires to leave behind your entire life and history and culture(to some degree) to start over in a different society. I certainly learned a lot from all of you and it helps to know that what ever choices we all decide to go with no matter what there are people out there that are making it work despite a set back or two. And those that are having to shift some of your original plans I want to especially offer you even more good fortune for your path forward. The idea of moving to any country can be awfully scary because of the tug it can have on our instincts to move on that idea while knowing the actual outcome could possibly turn out to be less than a great fit. And with Brexit becoming a new reality in a decision to live in the UK, that for some people can make living there more complicated and especially if planned options included Europe in your over-all plans.

It sounds like despite any hurdles you may have had to overcome most of you would do it all again and move to the UK, and generally you've been embraced as a positive addition to British society and not thought of as a "problematic invasion foreign immigrant".  Am I getting that opinion correct? And if that is the case then that is very reassuring considering there is a lot constant news of anti immigrant sentiments expressed in the last few years which many people believe lead to the Brexit vote to leave.

I am curious do you feel that life in the UK in terms of quality of the economy, healthcare, inclusiveness is the best in Europe or would you say that Portugal, Belgium or some other EU top country offers a better deal over-all? And do you feel quality of life in the UK is getting worse compared to what it was when you first moved there?  Again I'm not asking that question just to compare apple to apple but instead to see just how happy you are with life in the UK.

Thank you for your help.

I'm most concerned about things not mentioned in this post, losing protections afforded by being a member of the EU and the government needing to abide by them. I understand for some businesses they were a headache, but from a consumer safety and food standards point of view they are needed. And from a human rights angle, entirely responsible for keeping the UK accountable. I have no faith in the current government doing anything to protect or improve life for the vulnerable in society, and EU investment has kept many of the towns that voted for Brexit afloat. I'm very pessimistic about it all, but losing the ability to move to Europe wasn't at the top of my concerns.

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This was a very note worthy statement and I'm very curious if you could expand on your thoughts about what exactly does the EU rules help to regulate in terms of societal problems in the UK regarding human rights that might be less than taken serious? Are we talking racial acceptance, gender bias, or what specific social ill have you noticed that is quite systemic in the UK that needs EU policing?  Is the UK in your opinion the most progressive country in the EU?

The UK is currently in breach of the UN charter of human rights for their treatment of disabled people. The government has spent years publicly demonising them.

The UK home office has illegally deported a number of victims of slavery.

The UK has (possibly systemically) denied Europeans the right to vote in the last EU election. Still TBD to see where those failings occurred.

The UK wants a trade deal with the US and they can't get it right now because of the European laws for food safety.

The UK receives a significant amount of farm subsidies from the EU.

The UK receives a significant amount of research funding from the EU. This is important considering the home office's blatant discrimination of African and Middle Eastern academics. (this has been in the news)

The UK is not a nice country to live in if you are a member of any marginalised group, and as you've seen with the home office, without another body to raise issues to there isn't the accountability needed.

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Yarl's Wood female asylum detention centre is a nightmare. There have been too many reports of sexual predation by the staff to list here - sick, sick sh*t like having to trade sexual favours for personal hygiene products. Run by private contractors (very profitably by-the-way), attempts to investigate have been stonewalled, with even the UN special rapporteur on violence against women being denied access. There have been hunger strikes and suicide attempts. At present the UK is the only country in Europe which has no statutory limit on the length of time asylum seekers can be held.

In 2015 Channel 4 news infiltrated the compound and amongst many other things filmed, staff were heard to say:

“They’re animals. They’re beasties. They’re all animals. Caged animals. Take a stick with you and beat them up. Right?”

“Headbutt the b*tch,” one guard says. “I’d beat her up.”

These women are seeking asylum, many fleeing rape and violence. Seeking asylum is a fundamental human right, one we all agreed to (the UK drafted the *bleep*ing language), it is not a crime.

would you say that Portugal, Belgium or some other EU top country offers a better deal over-all?

This is really starting to sound familiar now.  Like we had a huge contentious thread where the OP kept trying to get people to say life was better or worse in other countries when the only answer is that most don't know because they've never lived in Europe.

OverheadSmash, I'm also curious about what's going on here.  Why come back every two years and ask this specific question? 

You all gave some very open and helpful assessments of how your life has measured up since living in the UK and I appreciate your experiences a great deal. A lot of people don't fully understand the courage and commitment it requires to leave behind your entire life and history and culture(to some degree) to start over in a different society. I certainly learned a lot from all of you and it helps to know that what ever choices we all decide to go with no matter what there are people out there that are making it work despite a set back or two. And those that are having to shift some of your original plans I want to especially offer you even more good fortune for your path forward. The idea of moving to any country can be awfully scary because of the tug it can have on our instincts to move on that idea while knowing the actual outcome could possibly turn out to be less than a great fit. And with Brexit becoming a new reality in a decision to live in the UK, that for some people can make living there more complicated and especially if planned options included Europe in your over-all plans.

I'm actually starting to get a bit uncomfortable and concerned with your posts - if I'm honest. I'm wondering if you are using the information you get here for other things (like I have no idea if you're a journalist) like using this information out of context to create a narrative. You ask very similar questions over and over again every so often (and sometimes it comes across like you're trying to stir the pot) and I'm not sure I understand why you are continually asking the same questions that you already have received answers to and you haven't really said why....

Maybe I'm just being cynical because the likes of other people appearing to troll in here has been more apparent recently, but I honestly am just curious what you're looking to get out of this information? What do you do with this information? At one point, you were talking about wanting to move here so the discussions questions made more sense, but now you just seem to ask repetitive questions without any context. Are you just curious about the lives of immigrants in general?

Obviously I know other people will continue to answer you and my response really doesn't impact you at all, but I honestly don't feel comfortable answering any more of your questions until I understand why you're asking them and why you're asking them repeatedly instead of just the one time?

Again I'm not asking that question just to compare apple to apple but instead to see just how happy you are with life in the UK.

I also can't understand why you care how happy we personally are with life in the UK that you feel the need to ask it regularly enough that we can remember it...what is the end game here?

This is really starting to sound familiar now.  Like we had a huge contentious thread where the OP kept trying to get people to say life was better or worse in other countries when the only answer is that most don't know because they've never lived in Europe.

OverheadSmash, I'm also curious about what's going on here.  Why come back every two years and ask this specific question? 

Yeah I just don't understand why ask the same specific question all the time? Is OP using our responses elsewhere? I'd be concerned that he's trying to stir the pot to either get us to fight internally (which is what I feel like Dani was doing as well...) or give controversial answers that can be used elsewhere to support a particular narrative or something. I'm probably just being paranoid, but his posts just don't strike me as natural or sheer innocent curiosity..

It's interesting. The OP started asking these questions in 2007.

I've noticed this pattern from time to time. Someone literally asking the same questions for years. These people are usually the ones who end up not ever moving. Perhaps asking the questions keeps the dream alive for them?

It's interesting. The OP started asking these questions in 2007.

I've noticed this pattern from time to time. Someone literally asking the same questions for years. These people are usually the ones who end up not ever moving. Perhaps asking the questions keeps the dream alive for them?

I'm sure you're right and it's completely innocent and I'm just being overly sensitive to it in light of other more recent posts (not by this OP) that seem to want to stir the pot. I just can't shake the feeling of discomfort just because I don't understand the logic behind asking the same question repeatedly and responding like they have been enlightened when they've had the answers before. OP definitely doesn't owe anybody an explanation by any means, I just know that I personally feel a bit odd about the patterns here.

I'm sure it's just me and, as I said, i'm just being overly suspicious here. I totally own that. It just doesn't make sense to me (and it honestly doesn't have to as I'm not owed that or anything) so it's hard not to ask the question.

I'm sure you're right and it's completely innocent and I'm just being overly sensitive to it in light of other more recent posts (not by this OP) that seem to want to stir the pot. I just can't shake the feeling of discomfort just because I don't understand the logic behind asking the same question repeatedly and responding like they have been enlightened when they've had the answers before. OP definitely doesn't owe anybody an explanation by any means, I just know that I personally feel a bit odd about the patterns here.

I'm sure it's just me and, as I said, i'm just being overly suspicious here. I totally own that. It just doesn't make sense to me (and it honestly doesn't have to as I'm not owed that or anything) so it's hard not to ask the question.

You are very generous with your personal experiences. Remember, it's OK not to answer if it just doesn't feel right!
There is a lot I would love to share but usually think better of it! 

You are very generous with your personal experiences. Remember, it's OK not to answer if it just doesn't feel right!
There is a lot I would love to share but usually think better of it! 

haha I am a total open book so I don't normally mind sharing (especially if it'll help somebody else). But totally agree that I can just hold back if it doesn't feel right.
There is nothing wrong with being hesitant to share either. Everybody has different comfort levels with this stuff so I totally respect that

I'm actually starting to get a bit uncomfortable and concerned with your posts - if I'm honest. I'm wondering if you are using the information you get here for other things (like I have no idea if you're a journalist) like using this information out of context to create a narrative. You ask very similar questions over and over again every so often (and sometimes it comes across like you're trying to stir the pot) and I'm not sure I understand why you are continually asking the same questions that you already have received answers to and you haven't really said why....

Maybe I'm just being cynical because the likes of other people appearing to troll in here has been more apparent recently, but I honestly am just curious what you're looking to get out of this information? What do you do with this information? At one point, you were talking about wanting to move here so the discussions questions made more sense, but now you just seem to ask repetitive questions without any context. Are you just curious about the lives of immigrants in general?

[...]

I also can't understand why you care how happy we personally are with life in the UK that you feel the need to ask it regularly enough that we can remember it...what is the end game here?

I must say, I share similar sentiments and concern.  I fully realise I may be overly paranoid and/or cynical, but at times it feels as though some of these posts have the sole intention of stirring up trouble.  It just seems these conversations have been had repeatedly, and with the same overall outcome from the responses. 

OP - are you still considering a move outside the US and still trying to source opinions and anecdotes from those who have already moved abroad?  Do you have a particular interest in immigrants and are just curious about the expat experience?