Pledge of Allegiance and OTT Patriotism

A schoolmate of mine who I recently reconnected with at our unofficial reunion dinner shared on facebook a photo of children reciting the pledge of allegiance from a facebook group called American and Proud with the words "LIKE if you did this every morning in school and think that they still should!"  Now I did do that every day in school but was under the impression it was still done in schools now. 

So I read some of the comments.  Most seemed like me to be under the impression that kids in American schools still did, there were lots of "my kids do" or "my school district does" etc.  But some of the comments deteriorated into the sort of...well... blind over the top patriotism is the only way I can describe it.  The USA USA USA LOVE IT OR LEAVE IT sort of thing.

Like this:" Yes they should it just shows respect for our county. They don't mind getttung the free services they get here. If they don't want to live here and our ways rge plane goes back to were you came from Than leave. Please" 

or this, from an Australian commenting on the rise of patriotism there . "I do believe every child irrespective of color or creed should take part in the morning pledge to the flag. IF parents find this offensive I would invite them to settle overseas in a nation that fits their requirements."  Yeah like it's THAT easy.

or this rather xenophobic one:
"i dont think r children should have to do anything they dont want to like having to learn a language that not american we do live n the us right i wood rather home school mine then have them go threw these pissy ass schools" Er...has someone not paid attention in ENGLISH class?

It makes me sad that there are people that think Americans should always 100% support everything the government does and never have a differeng opinion or belief or else be considered un-american and told to get out. 

Of course that sort of people probably think I'm un-american for moving here and becoming a British citizen 

It's a bit sad because we're at the point where if people think of patriotism, that kind of...well...bigoted? behavior is what you think of.

In reality, well, my reality, people just love their country and want to be proud of it. Saying the Pledge of Allegiance has become a sour subject in some places. A guy standing up in a bar when the National Anthem comes on (watching football...er, American Football ) gets made fun of. Even by people I consider good friends, who are nice people generally. They see that, and think of the people you're talking about.

Obviously, people get defensive and say ridiculous things. And those tend to be the people who speak up...something about the stupid gene coming hand in hand with the loud gene. I don't know.

Sorry for rambling. It makes me sad, is all. I am very proud to be American, but I also see that other countries have something to offer. I'd rather live in the US, to be honest, but my life has worked out that I'm here in Wales. I love it here, though. So. ..yeah. /rambling.

Ahh, yes, always a contentious issue that.  My old high school was a test case for the ACLU (they filed against them when the school basically forced a student to stand during it or risk suspension; the ACLU "won" as the district changed policies, but it was settled out of court.)
As a teacher, I always allowed students the choice of participating, sitting quietly, standing quietly, and in the case of one student, leaving the room and standing quietly outside (this particular student was a Jehovah's Witness and his/her parents interpreted things as such that she/he shouldn't even be in the room...) I never participated myself, and I occasionally had to explain myself to other staff and the odd parent, but no one hassled me--even in a deeply patriotic town with close ties to a nearby military base.
My dad used to alternate the "language" it was said in in his classroom, depending on the home languages of the class. So it would be in French/Spanish/Russian one year and Italian/ASL the next. Great fun and made the students *think* about the process instead of blindly repeat. He also, occasionally, had some explaining to do--but no real issues.

Oh yes, we did the "pledge" every morning when I was in school -- as well as the Lord's prayer (maybe people are carrying on from that controversy?)   The pledge wasn't even "under God" in those days.  But I started school in the late 40's and patriotism was still a big big deal then. The immigration thing wasn't that big of a problem. Displaced persons were coming over and more than happy to become citizens and try to blend in and embrace the "American way of life".
I had the idea that the pledge was not done in schools now every single day -- maybe only once or twice a week? But I don't really know.

I think it is up to each district, and sometimes different for different schools w/in the district.

These people creep me out.

My school district took out time during the morning announcements for the Pledge of Allegiance and a moment of silence, but you weren't obligated to say it if you didn't want to. I stopped when I was 14 and no one cared except for one teacher who was a Fox News worshipper.  

Anyway, there is nothing wrong with loving your country and taking pride in it. I love the US and take pride in it, but only up to a point. I don't think America is the best country in the world anymore and there are many things I would change. I don't think that makes me unpatriotic. If anything, I think it makes me patriotic because I want to see America progress and be the great country it claims to be.

I wouldn't worry too much about what these people think about your patriotism, SlicesMissus. I'm sure you're a "good" American. Whatever that is...

I love the US, and I think leaving it actually made me love it more. But I love it for certain specific reasons and not blindly. I just try to quietly pretend that the over the top people don't exist. I just can't allow myself to get annoyed/baffled/frustrated by them. It's one case where I warmly embrace denial! 

I wouldn't worry too much about what these people think about your patriotism, SlicesMissus. I'm sure you're a "good" American. Whatever that is...

Oh I don't worry at all about what that sort of person thinks of me.  It just makes me sad that these sort of attitudes are around yanno?

Oh I don't worry at all about what that sort of person thinks of me.  It just makes me sad that these sort of attitudes are around yanno?

Oh yeah, I definitely understand. 

I personally find it odd to salute a piece of fabric but I know my opinion is a controversial one. I remember doing the pledge in elementary school every morning but I was a kid so I just went ahead and did it because I didn't think anything of it. Once I got to middle school it wasn't done anymore. Would I do it now? Maybe - I don't like making waves and I have nothing against it, really. I just find it strange.

Jennie I really enjoyed your post.
Your dad sounds very cool, and I like the way you both handled it!

In my school, in NYC, I think that hardly any of us ever got there in time for the pledge! LOL!

Zoo York City. Bad school. Think, "Welcome Back, Kotter" but with younger people in the starring roles.

I remember it tho, because I am 43. They did play it over the speaker, but no one stood and repeated it, or was even slightly quiet for the moment of silence, which was also mentioned over the speaker. Everyone just chatted and did 'yo mama" jokes through everything - even class lessons.

I remember exactly when I realised some students would actually STAND for the pledge... It was when I watched the film Grease, with John Travolta, and Olivia Newton-John! I was about... 9? I think? When it come out...

Anyway, very interesting topic, and thread.

I'm not at all patriotic. There are a lot of things I like about NYC, and many other states, and a lot I like about American history, and politics, but... I have never been patriotic.

I don't think it is bad to be patriotic.

Really nationalistic people, or super patriotic people, do sometimes make me feel nervous tho. No matter where they come from or flag they are flying.

And I think it relates to what was said above: I think I mentally associate it with other traits, automatically. But, logically, I know I am being a dummy when I do that, so I try and keep it in check!

Even with the Olympics - All the Union Jack's - I would feel uncomfortable!

Too many WWII films, me thinks! LOL!

I'm with NOT... since leaving the US, I've actually found myself loving the US more.  Maybe I'm seeing it from a different and/or new perspective, or maybe it's some kind of expression of homesickness, but I'm much more positive about the US than before.  In the US, I would have never bought a flag, not even to wave around during the 4th of July.  But for the Olympics, I totally went to the Olympic Park with a pretty darn big flag, and was very happy to wave and cheer for the US teams during the events.  Oh, there are still things about it I disagree with, but on the whole, I've found myself a bit more patriotic than I was when I was actually living there.

In elementary school, I absolutely remember standing up for the national anthem and the pledge.  We all stood in a line at the front of the class next to the chalkboard and listened to the anthem and said the pledge.  In high school, I don't think we said the pledge, but still had to stand up for the anthem.  I don't quite remember what happened in middle school. 

I have some family members that were so shocked I would move outside the OH SO GREAT USA.  Why the heck would I want to leave?  And more importantly, why the heck would someone NOT want to jump at the chance to move to the US?  Like, isn't everyone just DYING to move to America?  My British husband should count himself SO LUCKY he has the chance EVERYONE ELSE IN THE WORLD WANTS!

Though, considering I was asked if England has MRIs, I'm not surprised.

 

Love it! 

Excellent!!

I was never particularly patriotic in the US because I always found there to be two kinds - nice patriotism and SCARY AGGRESSIVE patriotism. Sadly, I came across far too many people who fell into the latter category. Yes, I know there are plenty of normal, decent, friendly, good Americans who are patriotic, but there are also those other ones. And they're the ones who get noticed.

Oddly, over the past two years, I've noticed far more British patriotism and I love it! With the Royal wedding last year and then the Olympics and the Diamond Jubilee this year, I think a lot more Brits are feeling patriotic. And all I've noticed here is joyful happy patriotism! It's wonderful!